Half in the Bag: The Hobbit: The Desolation of Smaug

December 16, 20131,285 Comments

Happy Holidays, everyone! In this special Christmas episode Mike and Jay put Mr. Plinkett to work so they can be lazy and discuss Peter Jackson’s latest six hour movie about little people walking around a lot, The Hobbit: The Desolation of Smaug.


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Filed in: General UpdatesHalf in the Bag

  • Edyed

    Half in the Baggins

  • asdasdasdads

    hello

  • Fartastic

    No one likes small children in reviews, especially ones that can’t act.

  • Day_is_Over

    These movies feel empty and soulless and pointless.

  • Matthew Shannon

    thats because your life is empty soulless and pointless. fuck you!

  • Matthew Shannon

    in solviet russia, the Baggins is half in you!

  • Dimitri

    I will certainly do a edit of the three movies focusing only on the Hobbit book. :)

  • Aksiomet

    OK. Mike needs to stop overusing “The thing”.

  • Guest

    The way they say Smaug sounds like a christopher walkens impression

  • diehounderdoggen

    Smeogh.

  • Matthew Shannon

    im pretty sure Bard is a descendent of the royal family of Dale. In the book there is a sub plot where the people of lake town want Bard to take leadership of the town but he is too humble or some shit.

  • elitist-movie-snob

    That Denny’s commercial is epic!

  • Fartastic

    “Come with an empty bladder.” The same goes for this episode.

  • ohseanofnoise

    SMAAAUUWWWGGGGG

  • Big Mclargehuge

    I agree with the guys that fantasy flicks these days often try to be about EVERYTHING rather than focus on a core plot. They get caught up in epicness rather than adventure. Its good to have a complete world but a lot of that offscreen hyperdiegesis can just be referred to once or twice and we understand its happening. Its why I love Willow and don’t understand why people slam on it so much. It may be cheesy but its pretty damn tight and scenes have natural flow. You don’t have time to scratch your head or get lulled into a coma because it rolls along happily.

  • marko112kg
  • Hall_Monitorr

    I actually saw this movie in 48 FPS, and those ‘GoPro’ shots looked hilariously bad.

    I still loved the movie, though.

  • Day_is_Over

    Says the internet troll.

  • diehounderdoggen

    Who’s the depressed looking black guy? Eating the Denny’s?

  • http://www.therobotspajamas.com/ RobotsPJs

    Love that the commercial was for the Denny’s Hobbit meal.

  • http://www.therobotspajamas.com/ RobotsPJs

    I couldn’t get enough of this during the episode.

  • Brad Smoley

    Great review, guys. I lauoved it.

  • Paulus Cañamonjas

    Well, in fact Tolkien wanted Bilbo to kill Smaug, but he thought readers would never find this plausible so he created this Bard guy. I agree that´s a flaw

  • Joosef

    HD high frame rate was like watching Land of the Lost (TV Show)

  • marko112kg

    Could be they didn’t want to bother the kids with a lot of retakes, plus it works well with Mike’s, Jay’s and Rich’s deliberate bad acting

  • Rei Grim

    The ending was fuckin’ beautiful!

  • ColinJ

    Another great review.

    I loved the fleeting reference to the terrible dino stampede from KING KONG.

  • q q

    HFR is Superior

  • KonradZell

    They’re definitely not for everybody. I’m a little worn out on Big Epic Movies so I’m gonna take a break from them, come back in a few years, and hopefully appreciate them a little better on their own.

  • Guest

    So John Malcovich is a doctor now?

  • TheJackFromTitanic

    I’m Baggin for more of these reviews

  • malonius

    What kind of parent would let Rich Evans touch their children?

  • Edu Mira

    As a big fan of Tolkien and the Hobbit book, this film was probably the worst adaptation ever. Should not be called the Hobbit. There are so many things wrong with it that I don’t know where to start….

  • Sébastien St-Pierre Robert

    Yeah. They make Mike and Jay twice as awkward as usual.

  • ThomasHFoolery

    *whoosh*

  • Gene Parmesan

    How the hell did you get John Malkovich to be in your skit? Maybe I was wrong about you guys, maybe you have reached the level of Harry Knowles.

  • Noah Roalson

    I hated the first one and will only see this because for continuation of the story. Overly dramatic story telling at its finest.

  • diehounderdoggen

    Greg Ryan is at least twice as hot as Meg Ryan.

  • HollywoodIsDead

    Fuck Hairy Jowls

  • Noah Roalson

    I agree, I only watch them because I feel obligated to being a fan.

  • Gene Parmesan

    And here I thought this was going to have something to do with dwarfs.

  • Mitchell Taco Nash

    Welp, to celebrate my 1000th Red Letter media comment I unfortunately can’t think of anything funny or witty to write.

    …But I did just wake up from a Red Letter Media dream a few minutes ago where I was talking with them about their newly released video only to later come online to find they had actually released a new video. Has Red Letter Media found a way to infiltrate dreams? I sure hope so. Can’t wait for Space Cop in 3Dream!

  • Gene Parmesan

    Especially now that she’s dead.

  • Herrerasaurus

    Would you really want a film adaptation to be by the letter of the book? I think not, you want your books to be unspoiled by some other people’s vision of what they read, and your films full of action.

  • Sébastien St-Pierre Robert

    Whatever happened to the market demand for boring movies like Blade Runner? I want it back!

  • marko112kg

    totaly missed that reference

  • Gene Parmesan

    The kind that don’t have jobs.

  • Edu Mira

    I was talking about adaptation. Not about copy exactly the book. TLOTR movies were great adaptation bar a couple of little things. Now in this one so much liberty has been taken with the story adding new characters, plots and completely changing others that does not resemble the book at all. The only thing that speaks hobbit here are just the names of the characters and the settings. Except that, all the rest is invented.

  • Herrerasaurus

    Mike and Jay do comment on your complain. All the adding and changing is because The Hobbit book doesn’t have a lot of material to work with to make into a hollywood epic like the original trilogy.

    I have to argue your critique is unjust, unfair and unfounded.

  • Gene Parmesan

    I hope that Denny’s commercial is an example of the bizarre short videos we could expect from Sunday’s stream.

  • JohnBigbooty

    Did that first kid say, “A lego Batman with wings…and this time, pants.”? Ha!

    And I see you’re prepping us for the stream-a-thon with that surreal Dennys commercial. My mind is reeling.

  • Harmy

    I love your reviews, guys. You summed up my feelings about this movie perfectly. I was also thinking
    about what happened to all the HFR talk and was the only one of my
    friends to notice the GoPro footage and when it happened I was like
    “what the hell?” and everyone else was like “what, I didn’t see
    anything.”

  • Megatron

    Hobo Baggins was half inside me once. Now it burns when I pee.

  • Edu Mira

    I’m just going to give you an example: The love triangle Legolas, Tauriel and Kili. Absolutely pointless and not at all with the spirit of the Tokien world and is completely cringing. I don’t mind bringing a female character like Tauriel, but you could have done something different that could have worked very well in the film and no need to create this romance with the dwarf.

    Also there are countless scenes in the book that could have been brought in the films, most of them missed sorely by a lot of fans of the book if you care to read reviews around the internet. For example the way the dwarves and Bilbo manage to get in Beorn’s house without rising his ire. Or the Elves fantastic party at mirkwood that the dwarves try to get to until they are captured.

    I understand there must be changes in order to bring the story to the movie medium and make it work. But that does not mean you have to bastardise the story to ways where it is not recognisable anymore.

  • Brent

    This movie was fucking awful. It wasn’t The Hobbit, it was Peter Jackson’s shitty fanfiction, adding nonsensical plot points and boring, video game shit orc battles. Barf.

  • sepiajack

    I saw it saturday didn’t know until it started we got a 48 fps screen, I hadn’t seen the first one that way but was morbidly curious on an AV tech nerd level just to see what it would look like

    I will say this, I normally hate 3D but the 48 fps made the 3D work amazingly well, it didn’t have that ‘layers of flat’ / ‘pop up book’ look 3D usually does, and wasn’t darkened the way it usually is. There was a genuine sense of depth and Jackson seemed to shoot with this in mind

    that being said, any time the camera panned or tilted quickly it looked like a 1990s home video recording from all the digital noise and was quite headache inducing. And even my gf, and my brother’s wife who were with us and know nothing about this sort of technical stuff asked after the movie ‘why did it look like a soap opera???’

    so the novelty of making 3D work better aside, which I don’t care about because I prefer 3D, I’m not a fan of the 48 fps. The movie itself I was a bit let down by, I more or less had the same reaction as Jay & Mike, although I actually quite liked part 1, there was just too much excess, especially towards the end, but at the same time its hard to fault a movie too much that tries this hard to give you your money’s worth

  • This guy lol

    So I’m not crazy. I noticed the same camera shots in the barrel scene. Good review guys, I agree with Jay about the anti climactic ending. It was enough to make me like the first movie more, but to each their own.

  • sepiajack

    Yeah I agree Willow is solid, I never get the hate for that one

  • durhay

    North winds blow! South winds blow! Typhoons… Hurricanes… Earthquakes! SMAAAUUUUG!

  • Moses McSamson

    Same here, HFR was not noted anywhere and completely by surprise. Decided not to storm out, give it a shot. It took a while to get used to but it made the cgi characters look much more real. A cool gimmick but hopefully it goes no further than the next movie.

  • ChrisSnoopMarlo

    Woah, how’d you guys get John Malkovich to guest star at the end?!

  • sepiajack

    Supposedly James Cameron wants to make the avatar sequels in 60 fps. But I think overall the effort to make this popular has failed miserably and for good reason. I’m glad Jay mentioned the motion-flow crap on TVs and how much normal people don’t seem to notice it or, I’ve had them tell me “but that’s what HD is!” when I offer to turn it off on their TV. THAT effect truly is vomit inducing for me, at least the hobbit 48 fps is genuinely shot that way, the HD Tv filter is just a cheap simulation that feels like watching a migraine.

    HFR would probably be cool for a BBC nature documentary or something like that, but for a movie movie it feels awfully out of place. My girlfriend also noticed that her eyes were dried out from not blinking as much during the movie which seems like another downside of it.

  • CorbeauNoir

    To play Devil’s Advocate, a lot of it is being adapted from stuff Tolkien outlined in his appendices and notes, it’s just happening however many decades earlier now. Gandalf’s plot is pretty clearly leading towards the White Council flattening Dol Guldur in the third movie, which is something that actually happens at the same time as LOTR.

  • sepiajack

    That Denny’s commercial was amazing.

    I was however starting to grow worried towards the end of the episode that the ‘climax’ of the storyline was going to be Santa Plinkett getting a boner from the kid. I’m never entirely sure how far you guys will go…

  • Percy Gryce

    I see the boys got the other book on VCR repair that I sent them for Christmas.

  • nocussing

    I, too, eagerly await a fan edit cutting out all the unnecessary tacked on bullshit that isn’t in the book. Fuck the Silmarillion and all that extended universe shit. I want to see the Hobbit, not a cluttered mess.

  • sepiajack

    Nice! The gift that keeps on giving = a Percy Gryce who keeps on giving

  • sepiajack

    I haven’t done a fan edit in many many years, although I’m pretty happy with my attack of the clones that is almost an hour shorter (though nothing can make that movie good, only less awful) but I may have to take the challenge to do the 1 movie, 2 hour version of the hobbit

  • Nelson D. Robert

    Yeah, the GoPro footage was distracting. But, I was the only one in my group of lazy friends that noticed Peter Jackson at the beginning of the movie.

  • Percy Gryce

    You took the wauords right out of my mauoth.

  • Cameron Vale

    But that’s not something that Hollywood does every day, turning a single fantasy book into a whole trilogy, and for good reason. Is it because it’s a prequel to Lord Of The Rings? By that logic, if J. K. Rowling wrote a prequel novel to Harry Potter, it should be stretched into eight films.

  • Brad Smoley

    What a cauople of frauods.

  • CorbeauNoir

    B…ut they HAVE stretched out a Harry Potter book over multiple films. If anything Harry Potter is exactly what started that trend,

  • CorbeauNoir

    Weirdly enough the thing that bugged me the most was the molten gold at the end. Like seriously? It looks like melted butter, at least give it a glow effect or something.

  • Cameron Vale

    Did Tolkien actually mean for it to be pronounced ‘Sssmeaouwg’ or is it some elaborate ploy to distract people from Tolkien’s environmentalist sympathies?

  • Percy Gryce

    I’ve always pronounced it “Smog,” but apparently the good professor did intend this difficult pronunciation:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Smaug#cite_note-lotrtappe-2

  • CorbeauNoir

    “Despite Tolkien’s note, Smaug’s name is very close to the Old English “smeocan,” to smoke, the modern German “Schmauch,” smoke, and the reconstructed IE root,*smeug(h), smoke or smolder. Tolkien may also have been aware that a Polish word for dragon is “smok.” It would appear that Smaug’s name would be taken to mean “smoke” if the “smugan” connection were not mentioned. Perhaps that was the “jest” Tolkien referred to in the article.”

  • LukeMM95

    The ending was just perfect. Here I was, almost expecting a heartfelt resolution and I ended up laughing harder than ever. Sucks to be Jay I guess. Also I thought Mike was going to be diagnosed with not having a heart and the doctor telling him he should have died years ago. Another hilarious episode and overall another great year for Half in the Bag.

    Merry Christma….HEY! Where’s the next Plinkett review? Fuck this!

  • http://faddlechud.tumblr.com/ Faddlechud

  • StopThinkingBrainUrGoingToHurt

    This episode brought to you by Denny’s, refusing service to black people to decrease crime inside their restaurants by 720%.

  • Domo_Konnichiwa

    Are you sure he got out?

  • marko112kg

    Red Dwarf: The Desolation Of Smaughead

  • Percy Gryce

    Or cringe-inducing line delivery by kids that are obviously children of the producers.

  • http://faddlechud.tumblr.com/ Faddlechud
  • Domo_Konnichiwa

    He lives in the other house next to Kevin McCallister.

  • http://faddlechud.tumblr.com/ Faddlechud

    Stroke me a clipper, I’ll be back for Christmas.

  • marko112kg

    That last kid looks to me like Rich Evans. Is he his son?

  • Percy Gryce

    I’m not going to say I’ve been through the fire or anything like that, but I have crawled through a few grimy thrift stores in search of BOTW bait.

  • Nem

    How can Mike not remember the barrel scene when he CALLED IT in the Unexpected Journey episode?

  • Domo_Konnichiwa

    Or cute little purses for their kids’ wallets.

  • Domo_Konnichiwa

    Do your dreams occur in New Jersey or Wisconsin? Your dreams seem to be the key to all of this.

  • Percy Gryce

    Two words for you: Theodore Miller:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RbHxTaufDDk&t=5m07s

  • BenRangel

    I cannot believe how people fail to notice the high framerate.
    To me, movement looks jumpy as fuck in high framerate compared to the smooth motions of low framerate.
    Whether you like it or not is a matter of taste – but you must have an eye problem if you do not notice it.

  • Gene Parmesan

    He’s got a Bagul problem in his pants.

  • http://www.youtube.com/ac1dchr15t ac1d

    Fuck Mordor

  • marko112kg

    Same here. And it’s not about being a critic or a film maker, I remember noticing it when I was like eight. And yet when I try to explain the difference to people their eyes just glaze over until I show them a shot to shot comparison. Then it’s like “Ohhhhh! It’s like a movie now!”

  • TapewormBike

    Or Alois Alzheimer.

  • http://faddlechud.tumblr.com/ Faddlechud

  • Rene Belloq 12 inch figure

    wtf does Morgan Freeman have to do with anything?

  • TapewormBike

    It is way weirder in czech. Kinda hard to explain, but the way they translate the name in here (yeah, they do that) can also be interpreted as meaning “good food” or “yum”. Totally makes him a menace, I know.

  • BenRangel

    I agree. There were so many sequences with the flying camera that actually felt like crappy video game cutscenes.

  • Daniel Nguyen-Phuoc

    I haven’t seen this movie yet, but the way you guys talk about how it didn’t feel like a satisfying ending partially because it’s the second part of a trilogy is pretty much exactly how I felt about Hunger Games 2.

  • TapewormBike

    I have just peed my pants. I also like what you did.

  • Percy Gryce

    Watch your back, Taco. I’m moving up the ranks fast.

  • BenRangel

    I also liked the added love story. No the triangle drama, but the nice quiet scenes in the dungeon between Elfvangeline and Fili.
    That was one of the few times I actually felt something.

  • http://faddlechud.tumblr.com/ Faddlechud

    dammit Tape, Mike told you to come with an empty bladder.

  • http://faddlechud.tumblr.com/ Faddlechud

    New Consin.

  • Nem

    I’m more excited to see that cut than any of the three movies.

  • TapewormBike

    (Hangs his head down. Sack already hanging low)

  • Mike B

    I came with empty balls… What a huge mistake that was!

  • CorbeauNoir

    That sequence actually really hit home for me since last year after seeing a midnight screening of AUJ I had some “Gandalf-inspired” sandwich thing at Denny’s and my experience was pretty comparable to that guy’s.

  • TapewormBike

    Same as with eye strain and headaches for me with 3D – if I come from a screening and start to list symptoms, I am never gonna see a movie like that again.

  • Percy Gryce

    Sack = scotum or urinary drainage bag?

  • TapewormBike

    There is a tubing system that basically makes the former also the latter. And it has HBO too.

  • TapewormBike

    I thought the first Hobbit was ok, not great, but my girlfriend hated the fuck outta of it, on the grounds that it was too “hollywoody”. You can imagine how fun was listening to all the snickering whilst watching this one.

  • sepiajack

    Yeah me too, I love in the old BBC shows like doctor who or monty python where all the outside stuff was shot on film, and all the inside stuff on video, so every time they walk through a door the frame rate changes, its hilarious and jarring but sort of charring 40 years later

  • sepiajack

    Two words for you: Alcohol

    and I forget what the other word was….

  • Percy Gryce

    It sounds like the doctors you have there in Czechia got their training by watching reruns of The Human Centipede.

  • sepiajack

    I think that Wolverine episode is my favorite HitB. So many great moments. And since I got The Wolverine for xmas from my brother yesterday, I am finally going to watch that movie tonight!

  • sepiajack

    Is that still from the new Theodore Miller movie: Wolverine goes to Jamaica?

  • TapewormBike

    Well, Hostel was shot in here, I guess documentary style.

  • Percy Gryce

    It’s definitely top 5. (Not least because it features the 48-second-long appearance of the first VCR repair book I sent them.)

  • Domo_Konnichiwa

    WisJersey. WisCersey. Wisjersin.

    Yours is better, but mine sounds like an epic act of urination.

  • Rafe Ingvaldson

    No, don’t fuck the silmarilion. I agree, a movie of just the hobbit is great, but the Silmarilion was fantastic

  • sepiajack

    Yeah I always said Smog as well. I also thought Magneto was pronounced Mag – Net – Oh until the 1990s xmen cartoon where I discovered it was Mag-Neat-oh

  • Rafe Ingvaldson

    They were actually all tolkiens notes, he was planning on re-writing the hobbit before he died

  • Rafe Ingvaldson

    Just read the book.

  • sepiajack

    I;m trying to find this old vhs tape my grandparents had that me and my brother and cousins watched a million times as a kid that was a bunch of cartoons from the 1940 including an extremely racist claymation movie about a little black boy trying to deliver a pie but getting acosted by an uncle tom stereotype scarecrow and a crow. It would be an ideal BotW movie

  • sepiajack

    Yeah I thought they should have ended this one with the death of Smaug, and then just focus film 3 on the battle of five armies and whatnot

  • Paulo Pereira

    “Get busy trying to open the secret door. Or get busy giving up and going home. And that’s damn right.”

  • jt

    What are you nerds talking about?

  • sepiajack

    Yeah I consider my curiousity satisfied

  • CorbeauNoir

    Oh and where the hell was Bilbo? The entire hall gets flooded with molten gold but wasn’t Bilbo trapped under that big tapestry? How did he escape?

  • Domo_Konnichiwa

    Their doctors get on the movie-set training. It’s what makes their doctors first-rate.

  • sepiajack

    um… tapestries are molten gold proof… duh!

  • sepiajack

    the HitB extras where they make up other violent erotic fairy tale epic action movies for pre-teens is also a huge favorite of mine. Man of Steel was also a pretty great one too.

  • Nem

    Was the other word also alcohol?

  • sepiajack

    I was the only one in the theater who cracked up laughing when they clumsly cutaway to the crowd in laketown to the only black lady in middle earth as if to say ‘see! there’s at least one!’

  • TapewormBike

    The other word was “WholeBunchOf”

  • TapewormBike

    Oh yeah, that was kinda jarring, which it really should not have been.

  • Percy Gryce

    What fun would be life without snickering?

  • sepiajack

    it is it?

  • sepiajack

    Mike: “Who is the Australian man who stars in these movies?”

  • TapewormBike

    Depends on how many hours pre and post screening you have to endure of it.

  • Percy Gryce

    If I see that at the Sally Ann, I’ll grab it for you.

  • TapewormBike

    I wonder when will Jay talk about Mikes descent into madness, because his speech pattern is borderline experimental.

  • sepiajack

    It was very clumsy. I mean if they had just said “hey how about we make everyone in Laketown black, or a very ethnically mixed city, that would have worked fine, but to have just one lady after 5 movies and to make a point to cutaway to her specifically was just really sad

  • Percy Gryce
  • TapewormBike

    Exactly. Im surprised she was not “blasian”, so they can cover their asses on more fronts.

  • TapewormBike

    Oh have I mentioned that the sub title in here is literally “Smaugs dragon desert of destruction”? I wish I was making that up.

  • TapewormBike

    You wouldn’t understand, dad!

  • Yukonses

    Great ending. Christmas magic at its best. You guys have mastered the sitcom script.

  • Paulo Pereira

    These movies aren’t great. They’re awful.

  • Paulo Pereira

    I think you’re confusing Tolkien with Jackson.

  • fred

    It’s a little strange seeing innocent toddlers on an episode with this opening; “Jesus Christ why is this so fucking complicated!?”

  • marko112kg

    24 fps has a slight stroboscopic effect that distances the movement on screen from reality which is especially good for fantasy films, ironically. It also makes all the camera shakes feel more deliberate, rather than like just flailing about. when I was an editor on a local tv station, we used a stroboscopic effect (about 8-12 fps) when we had especially bad footage we wanted to make look cool and it worked like a charm. it superimposes a sort of rhythm to it that wasn’t there before.

  • Anthony Zombo

    Bard killed Smaug in the book, but in the book he just pops out of nowhere and over heard Bilbo talking to the dwarfs about Smaug’s weak spot. In the movie they made him a sorta important character for The Hobbit: The Desolation of Smaug.

  • illuminatedwax

    Monty Python actually made a joke in a sketch about this very thing: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1f-kfRREA8M

  • Lovely Henrietta

    (sits on Rich Evan’s lap)
    Dear Santa
    I’ve been a very good girl this year. I’ve only written two slash fiction stories, and they didn’t even have explicit anal sex! I’ve showered every day, been nice to everyone over the age of 30, barely been to McDonald’s, drunkenly flirted with weird smelly guys in bars only once (and it was my birthday, so it doesn’t count), and watched Castle Freak because my friend asked me to. The only thing I want for Christmas is to drink beer and talk about movies with Mike and Jay.
    Or to get filthy rich as a professional slash fiction writer.
    I believe in you, Santa.
    CHRISTMAS IS MAGIC!

  • marko112kg

    I, surprisingly enough, liked the ending of Hunger Games 2. It WAS a cliffhanger, but I literally fist pumped when she broke the domeso I guess I felt the catarsis (even though in retrospect they could have just broken it with the big ass ship they comandeered).

  • marko112kg

    God that tapestry looked fake, when I saw it i immediatelly thought of The Amazing Bulk

  • Michael Gleeson

    Watch it again, there are several more black folks in Laketown.

  • Daniel Nguyen-Phuoc

    I cheered inside with breaking the dome too, but then… it just lingered on her face for an extreme close up and I was like… “Oh.”

  • Michael Gleeson

    The actors name is Martin Freeman… it was a joke. Watch more RLM videos, you’ll get it.

  • fred

    I totally fell for that Denny’s commercial.

  • Jordan

    meh, they’re okay.

  • Anthony Zombo

    Same here!

  • guyinthehat

    And that was like a 600 page novel stretched out into two, two hour and thirty minute films. This is a 300 page novel stretched out into three two hour and forty minute films. There is absolutely no reason that The Hobbit trilogy’s run time should rival that of Lord of the Rings.

  • Jordan

    There were quite a few black people in laketown.

    Weren’t some of those human corsairs/mercenaries/whatever they were in Return of the King black too?

  • http://faddlechud.tumblr.com/ Faddlechud

    “Why does the tall man have a furry face?”

  • marko112kg

    That’s what girlfriends ARE for.

  • Billy Nunez

    That Denny’s ad is fantastic

  • guyinthehat

    Hey the lady who wrote 50 Shades of Grey got famous for a fanfiction of Twilight. Santa may grant this wish!

  • CorbeauNoir

    Some of the extended universe stuff has to be in there, namely Gandalf’s subplot with Dol Guldur. You can’t just have Gandalf vanish at inopportune moments and not offer any explanation as to what he’s been up to, especially since it’s related to Sauron regaining his power. If anything that stuff is less tacked-on than the main plot since outside of Bilbo finding the ring it’s the most direct connection The Hobbit has to LOTR.

  • Ammy

    Have to agree with you there. When I went to see the first movie with some friends, we watched the high framerate version. I couldn’t enjoy it since I kept getting distracted by the wobbly motion. My friends couldn’t notice the difference, which was pretty jarring to me. Very bizarre that they keeping pushing this.

  • marko112kg

    more tired than soulless

  • Now I Get It

    Congrats, Taco, on a run that’s been bold and breathless, and even exemplary. In fact, if not for you, I don’t think any of us would have caught that tapeworm that’s been going around.

  • CorbeauNoir

    Actually here, I’ll repost something I came across since he put it in better words than I can:

    “People have a hard time grasping the nature of adaptation. Different media have different demands. Simply transposing a work from one media to another can leave the adapted work lacking. As a result, it’s a lot like translating a work from one language to another, sometimes the translator has to find the appropriate local idiom, even entirely rewriting things (the translator of one of Stanislaw Lem’s novels actually apologized in a preface for having to come up with entirely new puns, because Lem’s original Polish ones simply couldn’t be translated in any understandable fashion) to make the work enjoyable. Things that a novelist might pass over because his work is entirely written from the perspective of one character might need to be addressed on-screen for proper understanding or pacing. A throwaway line might inspire a director to create a stunning visual sequence, or a lengthy conversation might pass in mere seconds on screen. It’s a complex task at the best of times and simply adhering as closely as possible to the original text is not guaranteed to make the best movie.”

  • Kenshiroh

    I think they just made the black people pay first, though, didn’t they? (That’s still bad, though.)

  • Rene Belloq 12 inch figure

    I know that name change thing haha, I just think it went by too quick. Thought they were thinking Morgan Freeman had done the voice for Smaug. Since he does all the voiceover work. Hahahaha. I’ve been RLM OG. Just missed the joke.

  • Kenshiroh

    While Arthur Q. Bryant did Elmer Fudd’s voice throughout the rest of the cartoon, it was Mel Blanc that said “Smog!”. (Learned that from a DVD commentary track.)

  • Kenshiroh

    Reminds me of those pictures of The Simpsons Lego figures where Marge and Lisa don’t have their final legs and look like they’re wearing thongs.

  • Kenshiroh

    They started begging people for money but won’t sell their movie memorabilia collection?

  • SkyDog

    I hate to be melodramatic on the internet, really I do… but two weeks ago my girlfriend broke it off with me on a frozen park bench to get back with her abusive, cheating ex-boyfriend – seeing a new video from you is the first time I’ve felt even a little bit better since, I’m not even kidding. You need to know much you folks rock, truly, and thank you all so much for the free content that makes me, and maybe other sad sacks like me, feel like a part of your great circle of friends for just a little while. Merry Christmas, RLM.

  • LelouchtheFilial

    C’mon, TapewormBike. People slip up occasionally when they talk about moopies for hours on end.

  • Harry Butters

    Another solid episode gents, when Mike casually mentioned Star Trek it made me laugh. I imagined Peter Jackson scouring every TLOR and Hobbit book like a total nerd in order to get those secret gems that any bona fide fan would drool over. Then I imagined JJ Abrams tossing the source material over his shoulder saying, “Just keep the iconic stuff. Lose the nerdy mumbo jumbo and let’s put this bitch in hyperdrive.”

  • The Summer of George

    When will you fuckers learn?? “NO PERSONAL CHECKS”!!!!!!

  • ThomasHFoolery

    Black Plinkett. He sits at home doing 70 minute Tyler Perry reviews while eating Denny’s.

  • Mark Bisone

    About ten years ago, I had a boss who was hooked on two things: The Lord of the Rings, and heroin. Humiliation is not just a forest in Egypt.

  • ThomasHFoolery

    Taking the final 700-page book of a 7 part series and stretching it over 2 films is not quite the same as stretching a 300-page fluffy prequel out to 3 films my friend

  • Mark Bisone

    Happy afterbirthday, Nash. Your ignominious record here will surely score you a spot in Cananaandian Heaven, right next to Robin Thicke and Cliff Olson.

  • Harry Butters

    Willow had hate? Never knew this but now that I do my Christmas won’t be the same. Thanks for that.

  • Andrey Tarkovsky Reference

    “I enjorred the Hobert: the Desolation of Smeeeeoorrggghh.” — Coach Z

  • StopThinkingBrainUrGoingToHurt

    Wow, I did nazi that comment coming, Anne Frankly I found reading about your boss’ addiction out of meinkampfort zone.

  • Lovely Henrietta

    Great! The only thing I have to do now is change the names and pretend that it’s just a story about two characters that I invented and not based on real people who could sue me. I’m going to call them Michael and Jay…sus.
    The sexy, a little bit kinky but not too graphic adventures of Michael and Jaysus!

  • Percy Gryce

    You see what he’s doing now though. He’s gone radio silent. Perhaps he’s mesmerized by the millennial perfection of his RLM comment total and refuses to rupture that perfection.

    Or was this some sort of game and he got to 1,000 points first and he’s now taking a victory lap?

    I feel like an era has passed, something is slipping away. I’m scared. Please hold me.

  • Herrerasaurus

    Your argument was that this was the worst adaptation, nit picking details that you didn’t like doesn’t really add to the argument. Films are either entertaining or not. So which is it.

  • dollar store cashier wife

    entertaining epizode as always but I woudn’t call hobbit great if I was intoxicated.video game like action,shit ton of boring/useless sub plots to pad things out,the pacing is still glacial like in part 1 and the visual side is drowing in fake looking cgi,poor 3D and diarrhea knowed as 48 fps.PJ is a fan of tolkien but these films feel soulless from start to finish.

  • ronin122

    Of course not, Rich Evans is a Virgo who hasn’t known a woman. At least not one who gave Dick his consent. At least so he claims in an episode of Best of the Worst (I forget which, but he mistakes “birds and the bees” as “birds and the bees” and brings up anal beads).

  • Herrerasaurus

    The reason for this even being a thing is because the LOTR franchise is so big.
    If J.K Rowling would sell the rights to Harry Potter we will see prequels to milk that too.

  • Percy Gryce

    He’s just a 12″ inaction figure. Cut him some slack.

  • Percy Gryce

    Now that’s a subtitle I can respect. Very golden age. Very pulp fictiony.

  • Mark Bisone

    I’m sure you wehrmacht by man Nietzsche roll leaders.

  • Karl Marinier

    Denny’s ad: where is that footage from? Almost look like a low quality movie scene

  • TheZaius

    Dey did a great jeorb dere in dat Horbit movie.

  • guyinthehat

    Good luck! May Christmas magic get you filthy rich!

  • guyinthehat

    Hope things sort themselves out for you and you find yourself someone that actually stays with you. Happy Holidays!

  • tjp77

    Review summary: This movie sucks in almost every way, but for some reason we’re gonna say nice things about it anyway.

  • ohgobwhatisthis

    I like your reviews, but I’m sorry, on movies like this, you just sound like nitpicky old men who are never happy with whatever approach an action-adventure movie takes.

  • LelouchtheFilial

    That… isn’t at ALL what they were trying to convey, but whatever.
    They were mostly just talking about the things that stuck out to them as detractions– not ONCE did they say it sucked in every way.

  • http://www.melodramatic.com/elite/puck TheReverendPuck

    Any chance you can put that Denny’s ad on YouTube? That was amazing.

  • http://acestream.com/ ACEdotcom

    that dennys ad was so funny i almost threw up.

  • sepiajack

    Yeah Henrietta, Guyinthehat is right, if it’s something you really love then go for it! There’s never been a better time to try and get your words out there with Amazon self publishing it may not guarentee your book will make the best sellers list, but it will certainly exist, which was only a pipedream for most of us would be authors up until a couple of years ago.

    I’m working on a scifi novel myself right now, and I definitely draw influence from things that I wish had been handled differently in the star wars prequels and other geek properties gone awry, if you love writing then keep at it!

  • sepiajack

    But none of the characters with lines or anything like that, it was still a very all of a sudden type thing. I am completely fine with them adding more ethnic diversity into LotR/middle earth, but either go all out on it or don’t do it at all, don’t just throw in a few token extras in the fifth film

  • sepiajack

    I was amazed they didn’t do a callback to the star trek into darkness review by pointing out that Smaug was voiced by Humberto Cabbagepatch

  • Mark Bisone

    So when the hell do we get a lazy, despicable gifspam of Stoklasa repeatedly reaching towards some young’un’s behind? I’m ashamed of you, internet fucks.

  • sepiajack

    I love it

  • Daniel vigil

    Where the hell is the Catching Fire review?

  • Lovely Henrietta

    Aw, the Christmas spirit is actually melting my heart :)
    I was kidding about the slash fanfiction (I used to write some when I was younger and the first Lord of the Rings movie came out, because that cast was too homoerotic not to!), but I do write and I have a detective novel that with some luck might be published soon (in Spanish, because my English is pretty bad).
    Good luck with your sci-fi novel! Sci-fi has always been my favourite genre, but I feel too dumb to actually write it…

  • http://www.plasticpals.com/ Robotbling

    They’re entertaining enough, and worth the price of admission. I was a huge fan of the books as a kid, and while I feel there are plenty of things to dislike compared to the Lord of the Rings trilogy, I also recognize that Jackson can’t please everyone. Adaptations are almost always a mixed bag, If you’re a slave to the source material you get bashed for not taking any risks, but if you change things too much you’ll upset the fans. It’s maybe not The Hobbit film we want, but it seems like a decent compromise compared to what could have been in the hands of some other director. So far the trilogy is nowhere near as bad as Spielberg’s adaptation of Jurassic Park: Lost World.

  • OrokuSaki

    Any one of those kids would have made a better Anakin Skywalker than Jake Llyod.

  • Mark Bisone

    Yeah, sure, he’s got 1000 posts.

    But what’s his batting average? On-base percentage? Base-on-balls? Hands-on-balls? Cut-penis-hands-on-base-on-balls?

    Check your facts.

  • http://about.me/hexeno Hexeno

    ” Here I was, almost expecting a heartfelt resolution…”

    Heartfelt resolution? On HiTB? lol

  • TJ

    I went and saw this with some friends Saturday night and….eh. Just. Eh. Smauughgh looked great and his scene with Bilbo was excellent, but that was about it in my opinion. They definitely saved the CGI budget for the dragon because all of the other effects looked like shit (i.e., riding on horses, molten gold, etc.)

  • http://about.me/hexeno Hexeno

    Your soul

  • http://about.me/hexeno Hexeno

    No, he’s CGI young Rich Evans.

  • http://about.me/hexeno Hexeno

    I wish I could turn my shitty fanfiction into licenced movies.

  • Noah Roalson

    I like the book. Not as good as LotR but still great in its own right… I simply don’t like the way The Hobbit has been adapted.

  • nocussing

    There doesn’t have to be a connection.

  • Alex Lee

    Mike’s opinion on the Star Trek movies in this review is precisely what I thought of the J.J. verse; it needs to feel like a universe, and the best example I can think of is if the writers started emulating the Mass Effect series. It’s also an action-oriented series, but it goes beyond with giving entire races a baseline character and history. As a result, it reaches out to the general audiences while also engaging fans into the intricacies of the story.

  • Percy Gryce

    Faddlechud, make it so! Bisone’s inspiration ain’t gonna edit itself.

  • Daniel

    martin freeman….

  • Smooog
  • Hale

    I think the main reason for Tolkein’s style was due to him emulating really old English and Nordic stories and legends, which tended to be very detail-oriented. Hence all the “fortnights” Mike and Jay were complaining about when they talked about reading the books.

  • Mitchell Taco Nash

    Oh, you guys just make all four of my cheeks blush. :)

  • Mitchell Taco Nash

    That episode must have made that frozen park bench feel awfully awkward.

    But seriously, though, hope things get better for you, mate! It’s a joy having this feeling of togetherness, even if it’s through an internet forum with a bunch of people you’ve never met. Red Letter Media and the awesome people behind it truly feel like they’re a part of my life.

  • http://faddlechud.tumblr.com/ Faddlechud

    We’re here for you, bro.

  • Awful Words

    Seriously. I have never laughed so much in my life.

  • Paul Schumann

    Of course you have a top 5… ;)

  • http://faddlechud.tumblr.com/ Faddlechud

    As a resident RLM gif maker…. gif smith?…. I have to say that I considered this, but felt it may have been going too far in a few places. Imma leave that to someone else…

  • Joe Syxpac

    Crap. I knew you guys would do the Hobbit next and I still didn’t go out and see the movie.

    So now I’m stuck wondering if I should watch this and ruin it for myself or wait until I see the movie. Cuz this will be here for, like, ever.

    On the other hand, I have read the book. Not like it’s gonna spoil anything for me.

  • http://faddlechud.tumblr.com/ Faddlechud

    Fuck movies.

  • vicomtepicabia

    Yeah, often it’s like, the only reason they got captured was so they could escape, and the only reason they were able to escape was so they could get recaptured.

  • http://faddlechud.tumblr.com/ Faddlechud

    true dat.

  • Joe Syxpac

    I don’t fuck movies often…

    …but when I do, I typically do it doggie style.

  • Joe Syxpac

    Aaaaaand of course Care Boars Save Christmas…

  • LelouchtheFilial

    So… you fuck Cop Dog, then?

  • Mohamad Taufiq Morshidi

    “It’s so dense, every single image has so many things going on”

    -Saruman

  • Jay Stein

    BRAVO!! I’m having a SHITTY December and RLM is the only joy there is….I’m a depraved sick fuck…..Thanks Mike and Jay…and of course Mr. Evans..

  • Jay Stein

    at 48 frames per second? In 3D?

  • Jay Stein

    Please MOAR fake ads!!!

  • Jay Stein

    Were you the guy in the Dennys ad?

  • jnorris441

    The Mayor of Milwaukee is also a doctor???

  • Jay Stein

    Think of the Hobbit as the seed and LOTR as the Tree that sprang forth from that seed, and the Silmarillian as all of the Leaves and branches and fruit and stuff…..

  • CorbeauNoir

    So the ring just magically comes out of Frodo’s asshole in FotR, then? Of course there needs to be a connection, that’s how you get things like ‘plot’ and ‘motivation’ established. This is the stuff that establishes LotR even existing as a story.

  • Jay Stein

    The Muppet show was filmed in PAL. It was an ITC production and my Mom and I would notice the “choppy movements sometimes. Everyone thought we were crazy…This was in the 70’s by the way..

  • fuckstick

    So Bard is kinda just Bard of Lake Town, some guardsman. But there are a few contributing factors to Smaug being killed. 1) Bilbo spots the hole in smaugs breast. 2) The thrush is one of the ancient birds who can communicate with some of the men of lake town. Bilbo tells the thrush to rely the information to the Lakemen. 3) The thrush tells Bard. 4) Bard has an magic arrow that was passed down to him from when the Lakemen lived in Dale. 5) The Thrush flys by the hole to help Bard Target the Hole. 6) Bard is a badass with a bow. So its a lot of information, but Tolkein did kind of just put it out there and I think for the most part that is not to much for the reader to accept those premises at face value in the context of a fantasy saga. The film version however really blows up all these premises and moves them around which is unfortunate and distracting to the viewer. Things are explained that don’t need to be established for the action to make sense to the viewer.

  • nocussing

    Bilbo finds and uses the ring in the Hobbit. Gives it to Frodo in Fellowship. Gollum is upset. What else needs to be said?

  • Cameron Vale

    They seemed pretty positive about it, clarifying that it’s a solid film but that its grasping for LotR-style epicness is a lost cause.

  • Cameron Vale

    The truth, it hurts.

  • Ronin Dave

    Enjoyed the film more than the first one however some of the action scenes went on a little too long and could have easily been reduced a bit – the barrel-fight scene and the dwarves vs dragon scenes being the chief ones. Reducing those scenes could have allowed for more character develop of the other dwarves, Bard, the Master of the Town and Laketown in general. However Smaug has got to be one of the best dragons on screen.

  • Leather Mug

    This is a 3 star movie AT BEST. It was the worst LOTR movie to date. Lots of misfires with the story, the directing, and with the tone. Also it was BORING, joyless (it had the least laughs), and very little Bilbo, which is a fucking shame because Martin Freeman is awesome and 10 times the actor that Elijah Wood is.

    I’m amazed that Jackson glossed over Beorn’s scenes! Beorn KILLS GOBLINS and BRINGS A HEAD back to his house. JACKSON CUT THAT??? And then we spend – maybe – 10 MINUTES in Mirkwood, which should have been a major setting for the story.

    Also, I’m worried because the final chapter of this story hinges on Bilbo’s relationship with the Dwarves; ie. questioning Thorin’s motives and choosing a path that will work best for everyone. Yet I felt distant from the Dwarves and from Bilbo in this movie.

    Should we really give a fuck about Bard vs. The Master of Laketown? Is that story worth screen time when we have other, more important characters to focus on? Why waste time with smuggling in fish barrels and with showing us Bard’s kids and all that other nonsense? Oh, but wait, he’s a widower! Well who cares? It’s irrelevant. In the final analysis, this is Bilbo’s story and that’s why I was excited for these movies and that’s why I’m so disappointed. I felt like I had seen more of LEGOLAS than of Bilbo when I walked out of the theater.

    These could have been great movies with subtle comments on greed and corruption. Instead we are getting CGI action (George Lucas), sappy drama (lazy), and tired political commentary delivered with the subtlety of a hammer.

    Maybe the last movie will be stunning and very emotional. But as heavy-handed as this one felt, I doubt it.

  • marko112kg

    Aaaahaha

  • jcal7

    Love Half in the Bag but I think they are being too hard on a wildly entertaining movie… lots of critics are slating it about adding new characters and padding it out but I think that’s mostly in people’s heads. I went with people who had not read the books and they didnt even know Tauriel was created for the movie, once they did they started nitpicking. This is not the Hobbit book, this is the movie adaptation to go along with the LOTR movies and it works in that regard .I rewatched the original trilogy at the weekend and the relationship between Bilbo and Gandalf is given more weight because of the new movies. There are also lots of little references to Smaug and the journey that I had not noticed before.

    Bilbo chooses to go on this journey to actualise the Took urges in him, Frodo goes because the quest has befallen to him: this is going to be a more lighthearted movie than LOTR. Well acted, wonderfully shot, action was up a notch but at the same time it had something pulling it together moreso than the first one.

    One other thing, like I said love Red Letter Media etc but hearing Mike and Jay slate Smaug for not being ferocious and his scenes going on too long, and some of the padding is the first time I have ever thought ‘Well why dont you do better?’ about these guys. You cannot imagine the work that has gone into this movie to get it to where it is. Maybe M&J are a bit tired from doing HitB but it was a bit rich to hear them talk about great film making in such a cynical and tired way

  • LelouchtheFilial

    Okay, Mike and Jay never faulted Peter Jackson for how much work goes into these movies. But no matter HOW hard a director works on his project, that doesn’t insulate the movies from criticism of any kind.
    Mike ALWAYS makes a point of showing his appreciation of the hard work that a film maker will put into his project. In his Plinkett reviews, even though he was calling George Lucas lazy in the creation of the prequels, he admitted that he respected the younger George Lucas for busting his ass to make the originals work.
    And while Mike derided the writing and characterization of the Titanic characters, he made a point of admiring the insane amount of detail that James Cameron put into the props and the set. There was a certain duality in his opinion of the movie– he loved some parts, hated others. You’re making that sound like it’s wrong.
    Redlettermedia ALWAYS makes a point of saying what they like in a movie and saying what they don’t like as much. You’re making it sound as if it’s wrong to be critical of something you enjoyed. I don’t buy that, because acknowledging that a movie is good (Mike even called this movie “great,” so there’s cynicism for you) while STILL being able to pinpoint what you didn’t quite enjoy in the movie is what separates “praise” from “blind praise.”

  • Cameron Vale

    I think I would have been okay with a two-movie Hobbit. It’s weird, but still respectfully smaller than the LotR trilogy while being radically more ambitious than any previous Hobbit adaptation, and with a director who’s clearly up to the challenge of making it work.

  • Kyle

    Loved the Denny’s part, what was the song that played while he was eating?

  • LelouchtheFilial

    Mike called the movie “great,” so there’s your cynicism for you.
    Honestly, the insane amount of work that went into the film doesn’t insulate it from criticism, and the whole “I’d like to see YOU do better” argument doesn’t really work here because they never CLAIMED they could do better.
    So, the fact that they both enjoyed the movie, but perceived some flaws in it makes them cynical? It makes them tired? No, it makes them critics, and they discussed both what they liked and what they didn’t. Giving a balanced review is what separates “praise” from “blind praise” in my opinion.

  • Yakov

    I like to throw around that diagnosis, as well as holiday heart syndrome, during the grinch. bah humbug.

  • iagrmc

    Things will get better, hopefully sooner rather than later. Stay strong.

  • Ludwig Scroggins IV

    That commercial is my life. Merry Christmas to me…

  • Ludwig Scroggins IV

    No, that was me.

  • Ludwig Scroggins IV

    I don’t know who Denny is, but he is one sad son of a bitch.

  • strand0410

    Like Episode 1, I’m guessing some resourceful fan will eventually release an improved edit. In this case, it will cut all the necromancer material and needless action scenes into a ‘tight’ 3 hour movie.

  • derpmorederpstick

    More negative votes than postiive hope that showed you how wrong and off you are.

  • Greg G Gould

    Smah-eaugue?

  • strand0410

    Ah yes, the “I’d like to see YOU do better!” retort. FYI, I don’t need to be in the film business to have an opinion on film. No-one is criticising Jackson’s enthusiasm or eye to detail. He made about as good a movie as he could in project where the screenplays amusingly, have a higher word count than the source material.

    Cynical? You know what’s cynical? A studio splitting a small childrens novel into three parts to triple-dip at the box office. These movies feel padded as fuck as is. If they cut Evangeline Lilly, the love triangle, the Necromancer subplot or the completely made-up villains like the white orc, they wouldn’t have enough content to justify even 2 feature-length films. Is The Hobbit story improved by completely bombastic and unneeded action sequences? Does it make Bilbo’s adventure feel more profound? I don’t think so, but it seems you do.

  • derpmorederpstick

    “Wanna watch the Desolation of the Smaug?” “Sure I would Lauv that” LOLolol

  • GAY

    Smaouuguh

  • jcal7

    “completely made-up villains like the white orc” – news flash: the whole thing is completely made up… why not make up some more?

    My point is that there is a great deal of work that goes into these films and for film makers/reviewers to just treat the movies like this is tired and cynical. Why dont they just review some movies that they would go to see because of their own interest for a while?

    And for your points “completely bombastic and unneeded action sequences” and “Bilbo’s adventure feel more profound”… and Im taking it for granted you have seen the movie but just think of the first time you meet Bilbo in this latest series and look at him now, when he utters that line at the end… I would say that is a pretty profound, has he not grown as a character from what you have seen? And in my opinion the barrel scene was good fun, maybe unneeded but its just fun, so what? LOTR trilogy they fend off small armies of orcs ending up with little scratches, its not as if its new. Legolas was like Marty McFly at some points for corn’s sake

  • Wasperheimer

    Though I’m not among those who clamor for a faithful adaptation of the book with no extra stuff thrown in, I still found myself making mental notes on scenes that could be cut or trimmed in order to do so.

  • Big Mclargehuge

    They can’t say no

  • Big Mclargehuge

    You’re welcome! Christmas ain’t Christmas without self doubt and disappointment!

    But yeah, people do like to take a dump on Willow…

    http://youtu.be/5h9BEChCHDQ?t=2m28s

  • Ted Pringles

    What exactly is your complaint? That Mike and Jay found anything whatever wrong with the movie? They said it was “great” for christ’s sake and here you are saying they are cynical?

    The Hobbit 2 is a popcorn movie and it’s middle name is excess. Some moviegoers don’t want to suffer from overstimulation; some moviegoers might like a nuanced and thoughtful experience.

  • Big Mclargehuge

    This town. Is coming up a lake town.
    All the pubs are being closed down.
    This town is coming up a lake town.
    Bards won’t play no more.
    Too much fighting on the Smaaauwwwwg…

  • Heinzy

    If not you, then who?

  • strand0410

    “news flash: the whole thing is completely made up… why not make up some more?”

    Yeah. Why not make up some more? Let’s have a hundred more battle scenes with a million more forgettable villainous orcs because why not?

    The Hobbit is a great little novel which for some reason, you haven’t bothered reading. It’s a great story that could have been made into a great movie (singular) but for no better reason than MONEY, we’re getting 3. When New Line realised you can’t spread The Hobbit like butter over too much bread (heh), Jackson and co fabricated a bunch of dimestore villains like Azog, a weird love triangle (because why not), and other meaningless changes (the Black Arrow).

    Are these changes offensively bad? No. Do they make the story any more profound or the journey more meaningful? No. Are they needless? Yes… that is, unless you still think CGI spectacle alone is an achievement in 2013.

  • James Rogers

    I’d love to see the kids mums reaction when Mike and Jay turn up and ask to ‘borrow their kid’ to give to Rich Evans for ‘one of their online videos’

  • Big Mclargehuge

    She held the child aloft to them like it was The Lion King

  • jcal7

    Ugh, whatever you tiresome baby… I have read all the books, enjoyed these movies too… go hide under your bed if your so upset by movie studios making money in this day and age… I said why not if it works… you’re a naysayer who picks at months of work people have put into these movies and just blub out ‘D’uh, Money! Thats the point…’ from your keyboard perch. Disclaimer or not, you’re a cynical tool. Peace out

  • smylexx

    Gandalf ‘just disappearing’ is one of the main criticisms brought up by Tolkien afficianados for over 60 years. Gandalf CAN and DOES just that in the book. Sauron is a footnote in The Hobbit and his tale of his rise to power in LOTR isn’t diminished in any way by his absence in The Hobbit.

  • strand0410

    My mistake was confusing your sentence regarding people who haven’t read the book. That and… assuming that you had a thick enough skin to engage in an online discussion without figuratively shitting the bed, resorting to ad hominems, and puerile name-calling.

    I was wrong. Push you enough and the facade melts away like a T-800, revealing the over-sensitive, trollish centre within.

  • jcal7

    Just have to get back to work, y’know in the real world? Its ok T-800, you’ll get laid some day and the real world wont seem like such dark place… I would love to argue with you about Azog etc ad nauseum but i think you’re just cynical about these movies and probably entertainment in general, and dont have time to have the discussion with you.

  • strand0410

    “So get this guys. I told him… “go get laid in the real world!” implying he must be a virginal loser for engaging in an internet argument I started, amirite?! If he didn’t know who the internet tough guy was, he sure does now!

    I also called him a baby, a naysayer and cynical tool… not because I could counter anything he said (because you know, I totally could!) but because he dared criticise something I enjoyed, and by extension, my personal taste. My wounded pride thus forced me to take childish offence and get this…. at the end, I acted like I was too cool to continue responding. Fuck, I’m so money!”

  • A Ghost

    I really enjoyed Desolation of Smaug.

  • jcal7

    hahahaha… i didnt say you were a virgin… just that you being passive aggressive about what I said initially starting with ‘Ah yes, the “I’d like to see YOU do better!” retort’.. it was not even a retort, Im on RLM all the time, think they are great… just like I constantly stated its nitpicking at something people have put a lot of work into and that I (and I think you also) found really enjoyable.

  • Joe Syxpac

    No, I use GoPro.

  • Paulo Pereira

    JPLW wasn’t really an adaptation of anything, though it was a terrible movie. As for Jackson’s movies, it’s not a question of infidelity to the source but the egregious excess of bloating it out to three movies 2 and 40 minute movies. Also, the script makes little sense.

    As for this review, it’s nearly half an hour long, with Mike and Jay pointing out more that’s wrong with it than what’s right with it. Yet somehow, it’s a “great movie.”

  • Roger Sterlings Lucky Strikes

    The Smauooooog joke got old after the 50th time.

  • sepiajack

    Thanks! I love detective novels too. If it gets released in english let me know! My book is definitely more at the star wars end of the scifi spectrum than the arthur c clarke/isaac asimov end in terms of smart science, I actually kept the tech pretty basic, and in some ways a bit more steam punk since I also like old timey things.

    I’ve been working on it for about 2 1/2 years and nearly done the first draft, (currently about 750 pages), hoping to have it ready for publishing by this time next year.

  • sepiajack

    They were sort of just generically foreign

  • playdude92 .

    Peter Jackson is like a gardener you hire to plant some flowers and cut the lawn, but then he also puts fake marble fountains and gay little statues in your garden, requiring twice the time.

    I just want an earnest story, sympathatic characters and a satisfying experience. I do get that from him, but it´s a shame it needs to by buried under plastic marble.

  • Fred Frink

    Can anyone explain why 48 fps looks sped up to me?

    i.e. shouldnt the faster frame rate the better, smoother it is – not like keystone cops? (which had way less than normal, like 12 – 20 fps)

  • Paulo Pereira

    Huh? He didn’t overhear Bilbo, a little bird told him.

  • Fred Frink

    better to have loved & lost then not loved at all. Then you get bored of even caring about that shit. Yes i’m a husk. Now get the fuck over it you wet mutt.

  • Edu Mira

    @Herrerasaurus actually that is just one detail of many of stuff that was invented. There were many: Gandalf wasn’t caged in Dol Guldur, The whole Tauriel line is made up (which includes quite a lot of the film), Dwarves weren left back at Lake Town, Orcs didn’t go into Lake Town, Dwarves didn’t confront Smaug (which is 30 minutes of the film), etc…

    Anyway whatever floats your boat. You think you are right and I’m wrong. I think vice-versa.

    @CorbeauNoir: Bits of it was adapted from the Apendix. Lots of it was completely made up. Gandalf investigated Dol Guldur before the events of the Hobbit. That is when he found Thorin’s father there and got the map and the key for the Lonely Mountain. Sauron actually try to hide from Gandalf and finally moved to Mordor. IIRC the orcs in the battle at the end of the Hobbit came from the Misty mountains, not from Dol Guldur.

  • Paulo Pereira

    Not sure that will be possible.

  • WrongWithYourFace

    Sometimes I just get so annoyed at people on the internet that I just can’t remain silent. Well, this is one of those times…

    jcal7, I can’t believe that “a lot of effort was put into this” bullshit you’re pulling. So basically what you’re saying is that if someone puts a lot of effort into something, you’re not allowed to criticize them? Sure, someone can make a movie with ten hours worth of stunning CG effects that takes insane amounts of time to complete, but that doesn’t make the movie good. You can’t justify overly stretched action scenes with “hell, why not?” Its existence has to make sense and progress the story, otherwise it’s just boring. I’m sure Transformers had a lot of effort put into the CG action. Are those movies good? No.

    And that “news flash: the whole thing is completely made up… why not make up some more?” point? It’s called an “adaption”. The source material is made up, yes. It doesn’t mean you should add MORE made-up things just to stretch it into a megalomaniac cash magnet. If they want to do all the crazy additional stuff, they might as well just do a spin-off set in the same universe. You know, with an original story?

    Call me cynical all you want since that seems to be the only “counter” argument you have.

  • WrongWithYourFace

    Because it is sped up? If you watch the Hobbit: The Unexpected Journey episode of Half In the Bag, they have a pretty good explanation for you there.

  • maggit

    I’ve read Hobbit a long ago but I remember him being referenced only during the fight… and his whole arc was about as long as “Bard the son of X shot the dragon in its heart”.

  • Paulo Pereira

    Thanks for keepin’ it real.

  • Paulo Pereira

    Or “Latinafrican:.

  • Guest

    I don’t know how a fan edit would be possible.

  • Now I Get It
  • sepiajack

    strand0410 and jcal7, this internet conversation you’re having is a rerun, or maybe a remake of a reboot. Either way, we’ve all seen this one already.

  • http://www.plasticpals.com/ Robotbling

    Actually JPLW was based on the novel by Crichton. Crichton wrote that novel knowing full well it would become a film, so he wrote it like one. Had Spielberg adapted it faithfully the movie would have been a great sequel. Instead, he changed a lot of details, and introduced new scenes such as the horrible “little gymnastic girl vs raptor” scene, and tacked on the indulgent T-Rex “Godzilla” segment at the end. Meanwhile, some of the best parts of the book were left out, like the dinosaur that inherited the chameleon’s ability to change color (if you remember, in the first movie some dinosaurs’ DNA was filled in using frog DNA, in this case it was a chameleon’s DNA).

    As far as HITB focusing too much on a film’s negatives, I think they realized they were doing that during their discussion. Mike pretty much said as much. They often review bad movies, so dissecting all the stuff they didn’t like is probably a habit that’s hard to break even when they enjoy a film over all.

  • Paulo Pereira

    Half in the Baggins.

  • Paulo Pereira

    Christopher Walkens should have voiced Schmorg. That would have been EPIC.

  • Paulo Pereira

    “Harry Potter and the Scarring of the Scar”

  • Paulo Pereira

    Batting average on balls kicked repeatedly?

  • Paulo Pereira

    Exactly. Gandalf isn’t the protagonist, the HOBBIT is.

  • Paulo Pereira

    “Jackson is a great director…”

    Have you SEEN King Kong?

  • Paulo Pereira

    Oh, yeah, forgot about that book, which wasn’t very good either, so I’m not inclined to be bothered about it—though since the book was written to provide a basis for a movie sequel, it would have made more sense to stick closer to it. In any case, thanks for the correction.

  • smylexx

    Though you wouldn’t think that by watching these movies. He hardly gets any screen time! Poor ‘morgan freeman’. ;o)

  • Paulo Pereira

    Precisely.

  • Mark Bisone

    I think it’s technically called “a re-imagining”,

    If only we could un-imagine things. Get on that, Science.

  • williamsn411

    I haven’t seen Smaug yet, but I got pretty confused with The Hobbit. I’ve noticed that the most recent movies that I’ve seen (2 Guns and The Wolverine) have made me say “I don’t get what’s going on”. Maybe I’m just getting old.

  • Big Mclargehuge

    None doth doubt

  • Paulo Pereira

    Prayze Jay-sus!

  • TapewormBike

    Oh, the bad guys, yeah:) Sorta mix between Central/North African I guess.

  • marko112kg

    Naaoouuuwww it didn’t!

  • Mitchell Taco Nash

    I clicked on the Community tab and found something startling.

    Guys, I think I have a problem…

  • Percy Gryce

    “Tell me lies . . . .”

  • Rob Rose

    What in the fuck was that Denny’s commercial? It was brilliant and I want mor.

  • TapewormBike

    Yeah, I see couple of familiar faces with problems on there as well..

  • TapewormBike

    Yeah, I see couple of familiar faces with problems on there as well..

  • Percy Gryce

    Sequel, Prequel, Remake, Reboot, Reimagining . . . .

    That’s Hollywood’s current mantra. That or the names of the other dwarves in The Hobbit.

  • Percy Gryce

    Sequel, Prequel, Remake, Reboot, Reimagining . . . .

    That’s Hollywood’s current mantra. That or the names of the other dwarves in The Hobbit.

  • TapewormBike

    If anything, I expected them to be way harsher.

  • Guest

    It would have been funny had there been blatant product placement during the movie like there was for IHOP during Man of Steel.

  • TapewormBike

    You do realize that complaining about other peoples opinions on movies (which they LIKED) makes you sound like an angsty butthurt teenager, that cannot bear the thought that someone does not appreciate enough a thing he likes? Honest question.

  • hensandwich .

    It would have been funny had there been blatant product placement during the movie like there was for IHOP during Man of Steel..

  • http://faddlechud.tumblr.com/ Faddlechud

    That movie has more than two prablems.

  • http://faddlechud.tumblr.com/ Faddlechud

    Tyler Perry’s House of Plinkett

  • http://faddlechud.tumblr.com/ Faddlechud
  • Scottland559

    Don’t sweat it, dude. Mike, Jay, and the gang are my fake friends too!

  • Scottland559

    You guys have surpassed Tim & Eric in my book. When Tim was on I thought that was something. Now, I feel he would be lucky to appear on your show. Great Job!

  • http://faddlechud.tumblr.com/ Faddlechud

    Ooh, alright then… since it’s Christmas and all..
    http://i.minus.com/ibuoKlWkk3QXTi.gif

  • Scottland559

    Man of Steel? I remember Christopher Reeves throwing a villain into a giant Coca-cola neon sign! Man of Steel was subtle compared to that.

  • SkyDog

    This is exactly the behavior that got me in hot water in the first place!

    Boy oh boy, have I learned a lesson. :P

  • ident

    I don’t know who those people are.

  • Mark Bisone

    What about Requel? Dequel? Squeakquel?

    I think I need some Nyquil.

  • Mark Bisone
  • Scottland559

    :) Have a Coke and a smoke….

    http://youtu.be/vkfUUqowQjA

  • Cameron Vale

    Huh, I guess I really like this website.

  • Cameron Vale

    S-meow-g

  • Cameron Vale

    “you’ll get laid some day” = you are a virgin

  • Cameron Vale

    The term is Blaxican!

  • capnmorgan5150

    Hilarious as always, keep up the good work guys!

    P.S. More Plinkett reviews, please!

  • Mark Bisone
  • boodomi

    What do you think about the upcoming “Noah” film?

  • http://faddlechud.tumblr.com/ Faddlechud

    You got a problem… you gonna die

  • Showbiz Pizza Bear

    So it was a good weekend, at least?

  • bob665

    Thought the ending was really good. I also like the discussion about how the
    high frame rate 3-D and 2-D options you had. I know about me there’ll always be
    a level of competence a film can reach and then never surpass no matter what
    gimmick they try to use.

  • hensandwich .

    Or how about mike when he grabbed a wallet out from that boys back pocket?

  • hensandwich .
  • TapewormBike

    I know you weren’t asking me, but I think it might suck some hairy balls and I do like Aronofsky, a lot. Just that he has a teensy weensy tendency to be pompous and when you combine that with Old Testament and try to make Lord of the Rings out of it…

  • Captain Imabadguy

    http://dailygrindhouse.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/08/Room3.jpg

    He’s the guy who wouldn’t pay Chris R for drugs. And he loves Johnny and Lisa very much.

    Duh.

  • Showbiz Pizza Bear

    A child that’s told they are going to see Santa only to find out it’s really just Rich Evans must be like expecting to go to an amusement park only to end up at the DMV.

  • hensandwich .

    Is there going to be a forced love triangle like any other young adult novel or Hobbit 2 because if so it could be a hit!

  • TapewormBike

    Smegmawhk

  • TapewormBike

    ” I wish I could tell you that Bilbo fought the good fight, and the Sisters let him be. I wish I could tell you that – but Middle-earth is no fairy tale world”

  • TapewormBike

    I think he was mumbling “Coruscant?”

  • TapewormBike

    I had experienced the same last Christmas, only I like my comfort and prefer to be dumped indoors. Things get better surprisingly quickly. Keep your mind occupied (preferably with RLM of course) and you will get through. Good luck from Tapewrom to Dog (that usually works out, right?)

  • hensandwich .

    well at least it didn’t have an actual commercial break during the film like some hack fraud did recently (Adam Sandler). https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9laBLQd4i-w

  • WrongWithYourFace

    It’s the midichlorians. They are talking to him.

  • TapewormBike

    “just Rich Evans”

    Now, come on there creepy bear.

  • Lovely Henrietta

    Well, Michael’s best friend, Ricardo, is secretly in love with him and he’ll do everything in his power to stop Jaysus from stealing his one true love.
    Also, he’s a mummy. And Jaysus is the most powerful mummy slayer in the world, who can also control time.
    Michael drives a taxi.

  • TapewormBike

    Probably. Based on his facial hair, he could also be saying “All for one, one for all!”

  • Mark Bisone

    Oh, for sure. But taking aim at Sandler’s hackfraudery is like shooting gefilte fish in a barrel. For the sake of a million Petes, Snyder even had Ma Kent working in a Sears! Apparently throwing a big fucking sign behind Marla Brandingdo up there wasn’t enough. They needed to hack their brand into the shitty story and characterization as well.

  • boodomi

    I rewatched HITB 48 “Hollywood trends” episode and the actual Noah trailer felt like a joke made by Jay and Mike

  • TapewormBike

    Right? It seemed like a parody trailer.

  • hensandwich .

    I actually would watch an episode of that.

  • Captain Imabadguy

    The trailer is pretty terrible. Hopefully the film itself is completely different from how it’s being advertised.

  • The Summer of George

    HE WAS THE CHOSEN ONE!!!!!

  • Ted Pringles

    He has PTSD of that time Sinbad tried to steal his action figure.

  • Mark Bisone

    It’s like staring at the leader board down at the dog track, but with more shame and despair.

  • Ted Pringles

    Did anyone else expect a Christmas ghost to visit Mike and Jay and tell them to stop being such fucking douchebags? I feel like a comedic opportunity was lost here.

  • http://www.twitter.com/kzap333 Andrew Coleman

    I wanted to do that too, in fact I already know where I’d make the cuts to the first film to make it 80 odd minutes, I just don’t have the time at the moment.

  • SkyDog

    Just watched the first Hobbit last night, and was actually surprised by how much I enjoyed it – it was probably just because I can share in on Peej’s love for the material. It certainly wasn’t as hefty or dramatically resonant as even the first Rings movie was (that movie has moments that are the very definition of movie magic, IMO), but it was fun, light, and exciting. I can imagine the runtime being way too much for some, but I think my general love of the genre made me barely notice.

    One thing that people seem to keep bringing up is that the first trilogy had more practical elements, and that they’re copping out with all the CGI and whatnot – they probably don’t realize that a project like the first Rings trilogy is simply a once in a lifetime sort of accomplishment. In no way would I ever expect Peter Jackson to go through what he did in order to make those movies a reality, ever again. That simply isn’t fair. He made his magnum opus, and I’m fine with him taking it a little easier for himself – and it’s not about being lazy, it’s about being distinguished for prior accomplishments and being given some freakin’ slack. And honestly, the CGI effects are pretty seamless now and do a good job of filling in the blanks of where more practical elements were fit in the first time around.

  • WrongWithYourFace

    One should always reach into the stars. Jackson should be as passionate about Hobbit as he was about LoTR and WANT to reach that same level of quality.

  • http://www.twitter.com/kzap333 Andrew Coleman

    You didn’t need to see or even know about The Hobbit before watching FoTR for the first time, so this doesn’t need to connect at all.
    The original LOTR trilogy still makes sense without these connections so they should just focus on making stand-alone films, if they’d learned from the Starwars prequels they would know this (not that The Hobbit films are anywhere near that bad).

  • Paulo Pereira

    3 stars out of how many?

  • http://faddlechud.tumblr.com/ Faddlechud

    You know I was thinking about it, and I figure most RLM fans must have some kind of minor tragedy or depression in their lives to be able to relate to the sad and often self-destructive characters of the Plinkett universe. I think one reason I’m so addicted to watching Mike & Jay talk about movies is because there aren’t many people I know with whom I can have really in-depth and intelligent conversations about film, so watching them fills that need (where I live I’m surrounded by football meatheads who seriously do think that Adam Sandler’s hilarious, bro). So cheer up SkyDog, and take comfort in the knowledge that there are a lot of us here who can relate.

    And hey, it could be worse – you could be an elderly homeless perverted half-blind perpetually drunk serial killer who craps his pants and fucks cats.

  • Paulo Pereira

    Eliminating Bilbo’s scouting out the breast-hole pretty much eliminates the reason for his being there at all.

  • SkyDog

    He’s as passionate as he’s always been, in my opinion. It just shows differently now – he’s determined to make these movies the best and biggest they can be, but he’s working within completely different expectations and limitations now. The kind of quality that was captured in the first trilogy was a miracle of film creation – it was the sort of the magic that isn’t captured by effort and planning alone, it’s a combination of circumstance, luck and effort. He’s doing as hard as he can to make these movie have that same quality within new limitations, but he can only do so much to capture something that was so miraculous in the first place. I’ll cut him some slack.

  • Paulo Pereira

    “Lookherearesomeblackpeopleseewe’renotracist!”

  • http://faddlechud.tumblr.com/ Faddlechud

    I like to imagine that was the exact moment when he realized how horrible the prequels were, and he was hit with a wave of shame goou-ilt.

  • Angelo Elauria

    QUICK! Someone give that blonde kid at the end an OSCAR!

  • son of pluto

    If you didn’t see it in IMAX 3D you didn’t see Hobbit 2. Confirmed for gay

  • WrongWithYourFace

    Expectations from producers to milk the movies as much as possible, among others.

  • StopThinkingBrainUrGoingToHurt

    What has he had!

  • Percy Gryce

    Faddlechud: “. . . fucks cats.”

    Fred Frink: “better to have loved & lost then not loved at all.”

    Hmm.

  • Mark Bisone
  • SkyDog

    Yup, money is a factor, make no mistake. But I watch movies for what’s there on the screen, and not any other reason. These movies are highly competent, entertaining, and for the most part seamless. The illusion of film is maintained, and I can’t gloss over that by dismissing the movie as being commercially driven. Not wholly artistic or original, but still very well done.

  • The King Of Space

    After watching this video I cannot pronounce the name of the dragon with the Smaa-uuwgh inflection. Thanks Jay and Mike!

  • Mendoza

    It’s complimentary and cute to them but it gets old real fast. Assertiveness needs to take over quickly.

  • killermicrobe

    That’s probably exactly how it goes.

  • Disgruntler

    Still the best adaptation of The Hobbit there ever will be:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AGF5ROpjRAU

  • Percy Gryce

    Uh, I just come for the funny.

  • hensandwich .
  • Scottland559

    I’m not sure what this contest is over, lol. My point was product placement has always been present and in your face. Everyone makes it sound like it’s the decline of film or something. If you’re talking about overblown fx, then yeah, Snyder FTW.

  • LelouchtheFilial

    …I love you all.

  • Pa Kent Says Maybe

    Jeebus, guys! C’mon. “You’ll eat all this cake and think, yum, that was good cake, but then you’ll realize you probably shouldn’t have eaten so much of that cake because now you’re gonna throw up on yourself and others” is NOT a recommendation. In fact, it’s the opposite. No one should recommend to anyone that they should just go ahead and vomit on other people.

    What’s the issue? You can say, “Yeah, but only if you’re a big fan of this stuff. Otherwise, no — it’s too long and too stupid for much of that length.”

    We’d all understand. And, we’d still like you. Sure, the geeks would leak like they always do. So what?!!? Geeks leak. That’s the second thing they do the most. The first thing being, going to overblown movies.

    Other than that…great job. As always.

  • The HD

    Dang, I thought we were anonymooouusss (see, I did a Smauug thing there)

  • Scottland559

    If by “hack” you mean spend untold dollars to finance, then you are right sir or madam.

  • Pa Kent Says Maybe

    Whaddaya mean? It’s Noah! With battles! Like The Bible, only more 300-ier. How can that fail?

  • Pa Kent Says Maybe

    You are. You are getting old. Go with it. Everybody does, if they’re lucky.

    Bad movies are like bankies and teddy bears. You’re supposed to outgrow them.

  • Pa Kent Says Maybe

    Kind of. But Peter Jackson’s “gay little statues” are fully-articulated and they do Cirque-du Soleil-style acrobatics, dropping gay-little statue doo-doo all over the yard which somebody has to go out and rake or pick up with plastic gloves.

    All the while, one dumb plastic flamingo would do the trick.

  • LelouchtheFilial

    I believe that the cake analogy was called “hyperbole” and “exaggerating greatly for comedic effect.”
    Plus, be careful about using the words “vomit” and “leak” so much. I just had a flashback to Plinkett’s colostomy bag.

  • Pa Kent Says Maybe

    It really didnaaaaooo-eee-iii-eee-iii-ooowwwwn’t.

  • Mark Bisone

    It ain’t untold. Sears plunked down $25M to “subtly” slather themselves all over Man of Steel. Budweiser kicked in 15M, without the obligatory “smoking is bad” message that Marlboro gets zapped with. Only Zod knows how much 7-11 and IHOP paid, but they got themselves a bigger a happy ending than Donner would have ever given them.

  • Mitchell Taco Nash

    webzone*

  • Percy Gryce

    “. . . and this time, pants”? That kid must be some kind of freak.

  • Mark Bisone

    “In your face” isn’t the same as “down your throat.”

  • Mike

    Lol. All the blood is still on the walls from the fake Grownups 2 review.

  • Percy Gryce

    Did anyone whisper in Bach’s ear that he really should pick up the tempo and add a drum machine to the mix?

  • Percy Gryce

    What a fucking rogues’ gallery.

  • Percy Gryce

    Don’t tell me it was explained more in the novelization or some other fucking book. The movie is what matters.

  • Mark Bisone
  • Kevin Weaver

    I think the ghost was responding to Mike and Jay briefly wondering if The Bard was in the book at all. Which he was. If anything, he’s in the movie more than the book.

  • bb-15

    Funny beginning/end.
    And I completely agree about the review of The Hobbit 2.
    It’s a good film by a team that understands the mythology and who care about the characters. But it was too long with too much information.
    – Mike was right that The Hobbit 2 felt like a director’s cut. Originally The Hobbit was supposed to be done as two movies. The extra material was supposed to be in an extended edition only on DVD/Blu-Ray..
    But Warner Brothers decided that instead of making 2 billion with 2 films, there would be a trilogy that would make 3 billion.
    – So we are seeing extended editions in the theater. That is why there is so much padding which is a bit much while in a theater.
    Still a decent film.

  • hensandwich .

    If you want to have happy and successful relationships, take advice from Harry S. Plinkett (which Mendoza quoted).

  • LelouchtheFilial

    Ties in GREAT with Mike’s desire for “Star Trek movies to be more like this.”

  • LelouchtheFilial

    Hahaha… what a STORY, Mark!

  • Mitchell Taco Nash

    The can’t be TOO harsh on a film around Christmas. They have to be somewhat good. It’s the Christian thing to do.

  • Scottland559

    I left myself open to that when I said “untold”, I grant you. I really didn’t want to know. What are those in 1980 dollars, anyway? Also, I’m in the market for a new laptop, which ones are the best? Contrast and compare….

  • Fred Frink

    Goodbye Horses playing every day

  • Scottland559

    I wouldn’t know.

  • Mark Bisone

    Oh but you do, laddie!

    You’re just a bit used to it. Try opening your eyes for the money shot, every now and again.

  • Mark Bisone

    I recommend Commodore 64. It’s got 1 Megabyte of hard disk space!

    http://oldcomputers.net/pics/C64combo.jpg

  • http://faddlechud.tumblr.com/ Faddlechud

    Now that’s the definition of out of context.

  • Joe Syxpac

    Mr. Plinkett already fucked Cop Dog. I got sloppy seconds.

  • Tyler AitchKay

    you guys like some shitty movies sometimes

    This film is the product of warner brothers taking advantage of Jackson’s love of shooting Tolkien Lore in NZ. It’s an earnest attempt on jacksons part, but it’s a cold, cynical cash-cow for WB. And for that reason, above poor pacing, 0 characterization, awful rushed CGI, and that ABHORRENT mary sue she-elf, that this movie is bad.

  • LelouchtheFilial

    Yeesh. It’s either people are berating Mike and Jay for not loving this movie enough or for not hating it enough.

  • Grey Elf

    if they were gonna do 3 movies, each one should have been 2 hours max. i love the new trilogy, but i can’t figure out why on earth they need to be 2 hours, 45 minutes each. the theatrical cuts already feel like extended editions.

  • not_see

    “Mike and Jay, confirmed for gay”

    now there’s coffee all over my keyboard

  • Tyler AitchKay

    that’s what happens when you take a flimsy middle-of-the-road approach. Mike hates the SW prequels for the exact same reasons he likes this movie. It’s so fucking bizarre.

  • namelessIII

    “Whatever.” J.J.R. Tolkien

  • bb-15

    @ Grey Elf; (SPOILERS) AFAIK when Warner Brothers gave the order for 3 movies, Jackson and Co. were still under the tremendous time pressure to get huge movies released one year apart. That is a crazy schedule. And all the extra footage for the extended editions had to be included in some way but also the team had to create new special effects endings for movies 1 & 2 which had not been planned under that huge time pressure.
    * Movie 1 was supposed to end after the barrel riding sequence (which we see in Desolation of Smaug).
    – But instead the first film ended with the warg/orc fight in the trees.
    So, the tree fight had to be longer. And that added to the total run time of the entire Hobbit story and had to be done with huge time pressure.
    – The second film ends with the chase in the Lonely Mountain. That is also longer than planned and added to total run time of the Hobbit films.
    * Then the extended edition material was now in the theatrical editions and Jackson finding a place to cut this material seems to have been a challenge for him with the time pressure he was facing. So, he left almost all of it in and we have ~ 3 hour films.

  • Concerned Citizen

    I feel like this Desolate film should be on your Best of the Worst show, not Half in the Bag.

  • TapewormBike

    Based on his reaction to Mike liking the love triangle subplot, I hope Jay is now gonna do all sound effects like that and the next time there normally would be a fart sound, he will just yell “GAS!”

  • LelouchtheFilial

    A gas leak?
    SOMETHING TO DO WITH GAS?!?!??!?!?!?!?!

  • Fartastic

    Those were the days, my friend.

  • strand0410

    If you’re looking perfection in a filmography, you’re not going to find it. There is not a single director today who has not made a couple of disappointing movies, just as there is not a single actor who has not appeared in one of them.

    Peter Jackson’s overall body of work is excellent, despite the duds (Lovely Bones, King Kong). Even King Kong has many redeeming qualities and even at its most self-indulgent, can be appreciated. It’s easy and fashionable, but incorrect to bash King Kong as garbage, or believing it somehow illegitimises Jackson’s career.

  • Fartastic

    Jor-El fighting Roland Emmerich’s wet dream!(no pun intended) And even Odin is there! How can this not be great?

  • Fartastic

    If TapewormBike continues at that pace, your problem won’t look all that bad very soon.

  • Percy Gryce

    Your imaginary internet friends love you back.

  • dollar store cashier wife

    out of 420.blaze it faggot(like radagast did)

  • Jason Ross

    Woa, Dick the Santa boy

  • bb-15

    @ Tyler; no Mike hates the SW prequels for different reasons.
    – The SW prequels have a confused, conflicting and irrational story.
    – For Mike, The Hobbit 2 just has too much story. Mike understood the movie fine. He had no problem with the logic of it.

  • ident

    That was a real review.

  • Wethewax

    Jay put it so succinctly. The best scenes in both Hobbit movies so far, have been the ones that stick closest to the book.

    But my main problem with the Hobbit Trilogy, is that Tolkien wrote it to be a children’s adventure story, of about average length for the period.

    The story doesn’t naturally divide into three parts which affects the pacing. The attempt to achieve a more ominous tone jars badly with the parts that are unchanged from the book. And it’s been padded with material from the Silmarillion, a book which was cobbled together from Tolkien’s background notes, and released after his death as a blatant cash-in.

  • ident

    It wasn’t hyperbole. It was a metaphor extended to absurdity.

  • Bacchus

    I’d quite like to see RLM review Filth (the irvine Welsh adaptation). I wonder what they would make of it.

  • Paulo Pereira

    I don’t like LotR or AUJ either—at all. THE FRIGHTENERS was okay from little I remember of it.

  • Paulo Pereira

    THE SILMARILLION is more than just “cobbled together background notes.” He was writing that stuff long before he started TH. It’s the book he really wanted to write but couldn’t finish it before he died.

  • Smooog

    Good sir, there is only one failsafe rule to a successful relationship: Do not, under any circumstances, take my advice about relationships.

  • LelouchtheFilial

    The descent into madness isn’t complete without imaginary friends. Internet or otherwise.

  • LelouchtheFilial

    Stealing from children, Jay getting objects dumped on him and the Denny’s commercial all remind me of why I love RLM to begin with.
    Christmas is MAAAAGICAL!

  • Paulo Pereira

    These movies have script inconsistencies as well.

  • Megatron

    The only winning move is not to play. …Or to kill yourself.

  • Dixon Bawls

    This. A Thousand times.

  • mercianomad

    @Tyler, I largely agree, but the fact is Tolkien’s story – however awfully handled – is mostly still there somewhere, so maybe that’s the difference. Lucas’s story in the prequels was awful almost all the way through.

    Mike & Jay are clearly not Tolkien fans, so the films work for them as casual viewers. I kind of shrug my shoulders on this. For those of us who know these stories inside out, there is a divide between so-called “purists” who hate them and those who like them anyway. I’m in the hate camp, personally, though it’s not 100% hate. I have to admire most of the visual world in these movies and a great deal of what was accurately handled.

    The casting, weak characterizations of the original story’s characters, obnoxious over-scoring that nobody seems to notice (there’s music running through these films nearly the whole time), the addition of tons of stuff not in the books and exclusion of others, and the emphasis on making every single thing epic really ruins it all for me, but I don’t get into the ridiculous e-fights over it with people because you might as well be arguing about favorite salad dressings.

    Do a search for John Dolan’s eXiled article, “Bad Hobbit,” if you want to see a trashing of PJ’s LOTR trilogy that you might agree with. He misses a few things I would point out (like Jackson’s awful decision to tell all about the ring in the opening sequence of FoTR, which ruins a classic storytelling concept called exposition), the problem with casting Americans in a medieval-tinged world, and the hackjob on the council meeting at Rivendell (“Never trust an elf!”), but mostly I agree with Dolan’s take on these.

  • Mitchell Taco Nash

    That comment legitimately made me burst out in laughter.

  • TapewormBike

    What do you…oh fuck, no, that is one more!

  • TapewormBike

    Faddlechud: “Now that’s the definition”

  • TapewormBike

    I was really expecting the doctor at the end to hand Jay like a dildo-sized suppository.

  • Bobby Lee

    Overall, this movie was much better than the first, but it still suffered from one thing that harmed “An Unexpected Journey” the most: an unfocused plot.

    Every time we get great character interaction or added depth to the characters, we detour from the plot (most prevalent in the first half of the movie). Beorn the Bear-Man, the giant spiders, being imprisoned in Mirkwood, and the return of Radagast – ALL just detours that don’t add much to the story. Get rid off that stuff and let us get to know the Dwarves better.

    Also, the over-the-top Looney-Tunes style violence doesn’t exactly feel like LotR to me. And ever notice how no one dies in these movies? We only have 1 movie to go, and all the Dwarves, Elves, Smaug, and Azog, are all still alive. I guess they’re waiting for the last movie to kill anyone important?

    But overall, a fun ride, if you’re not a hardcore LotR fan.

  • sepiajack

    I was thinking that might be the punchline too

  • TapewormBike

    Sick minds think alike.

  • bb-15

    The Plinkett reviews of the SW prequels go into massive detail about the inconsistencies in those films.
    The Hobbit films don’t come close to having the same number of problems.

  • TapewormBike

    And blood.

  • sepiajack

    The first time I ever heard this Nimoy song was right before Fellowship of the ring came out in theatres, I was trying to download the soundtrack off of Napster or Kazaa or one of those oldtimey programs, and the file was labeled as “Radiohead’s new song for the Lord of the rings movie”, now I’m a big Radiohead fan, and thought it strange that they could have done a song for LotR without me hearing about it, but never the less I clicked ‘download’ and got this instead.

    I have heard it, I can never UNhear it.

  • sepiajack

    Bisone that joke was worthy of Plinkett himself, and not the HitB cuddly loveable Rich Evans Plinkett, I mean the creepy and hilarious disembodied voice of Mike version

  • LelouchtheFilial

    That’s a dil-don’t, gentlemen.

  • Percy Gryce

    To be fair to me, when I read the original comments they were immediately consecutive. I thought I spied a connection . . . .

  • Mike Jakermen

    Overall i enjoyed this movie. I liked the first one too. But the more i watch these. The more i think it would have been better if Guillermo del Toro had directed. He would have either done a one 3 hour movie or two 2 hour movies. I felt like the Dragon fight went on for far too long. And really you could have cut 30 minutes from the movie and it would have been just as good.

  • ident

    Right. He didn’t finish it before he died and his son, Christopher, cobbled them together and published them against his father’s wishes.

  • Paulo Pereira

    I disagree. And I think it’s a matter of preference. These guys don’t care about TH as much as they do SW. I would agree that the SWPT films are generally worse, though.

  • Paulo Pereira

    I don’t think it was against his wishes. Do you have a source for that?

  • Percy Gryce

    That’s a serious callback. I salute you.

  • Cameron Vale

    Doesn’t it say right on the cover that it’s by JRR and Chris?

  • Cameron Vale

    The doctor didn’t say that to Jay at the end. Wasted opportunity!

  • Duckler

    I’ve already watched this review an Nth degree more than I’ll see the actual movie, and feel fully entertained.

  • Percy Gryce

    That’s what friends ARE for.

  • LelouchtheFilial

    The walls, however, are fake.

  • Alex Lee

    They’re some guys that have a show on Adult Swim. I think they review movies, but I’m just guessing that based on what Scotland559 said.

  • Thanatos2k

    Love the terrible child actors you got who’s clearly not cousins to one of the producers.

  • Thanatos2k

    His name is Smaug. It’s the desolation of Smaug….get it…?

  • Thanatos2k

    Real gold actually isn’t that shiny.

  • Thanatos2k

    He had run outside….somehow?

  • Thanatos2k

    Seriously, this movie just one capture scene to the next.

    First they get captured by spiders, then they get captured by the elves,
    then an orc gets captured by the elves, then they get captured by the
    town guards, then Gandalf gets captured by Sauron… (why???????)

    Moral of the story is just kill your prisoners before they escape.

  • Thanatos2k

    I really can’t see myself with him.

  • Thanatos2k

    And he’s about to do the same to Star Wars. Should we be afraid?

  • Thanatos2k

    I would probably be on the list but I always posted as Guest names until they idiotically removed that option.

  • Mitchell Taco Nash

    Uh, I just cum for the funny.

  • Mitchell Taco Nash

    That ‘dere’ almost makes this sound like a stereotypical Canadian.

    Trust me, I’m a stereotype.

  • Mitchell Taco Nash

    The first? My god, man, how many did you send?!

  • Mitchell Taco Nash

    That’s the episode where Mike hilariously goes into another one of his faux-action-style fight scenes complete with self-made sound effects for ‘The Wall’.

    *Snikt*

  • strand0410

    I agree, I generally loathe the excess that these Hobbit movies have in droves. King Kong would have been a better movie if they cut 40 minutes from its runtime but Jackson’s bloat is still better than most out there, and I still think he is a ‘great’ director.

  • Cameron Vale

    Now that I think about it, there’s probably an interesting comparison to make between Peter Jackson’s Tolkien movies, Christopher Nolan’s superhero movies, and George Lucas’ Star Wars movies. A beloved though somewhat stigmatized classic subject matter is given to a strange, almost fringe director, who unexpectedly produces a legendary trilogy beloved by fans and masses alike, and plays a crucial role in the origination of Hollywood’s current obsession with traditionally geeky subject matter, but then follows up on this success by working on an attempted continuation of the phenomenon based on necessarily more upbeat material from the same canon, which is simply mangled to “rhyme” with that original trilogy in an attempt to coast on its success, thus revealing the chilling extent of that director’s absorption into the machinery of Hollywood.

  • Wethewax

    The books of the Silmarillion started as a series of writing exercises in the forms of ancient myth and legend, such as Icelandic Plain-song, Norse Saga, etc, etc.

    After The Hobbit had been published, Tolkien wrote some parts of the Silmarillion that were more of a cohesive narrative, but he couldn’t find a publisher that would accept it, and ended up concentrating on LotR.

    When he eventually went back to the Simarillion in the 1950s he found himself dissatisfied with it on a fundamental level, and started a process of “rewriting”, which ended up being more additions than rewrites. He never managed to resolve his dissatisfaction with the work, which is why he never resubmitted it for publication. Tolkien couldn’t even decide how many of the parts that he’d written should be included in the Silmarillion.

    After his father’s death Christopher Tolkien recompiled what was left, going to writings that his father hadn’t intended to publish for extra material, and in some cases actually writing fresh material himself to fill in the gaps.

    By the time The Silmarilion was published it was a compilation of parts J.R.R Tolkien had written for academic purposes only, parts that were genuine narrative meant for publication, parts that he’d decide to reject, parts from other works that Christopher had re-purposed, and finally parts that Christopher had written himself.
    Some parts of the Silmarillion are definitely material that J.R.R Tolkien did not wish to be published, and in fact expressly stated that he did not think were good enough for publication.

    If you wish to verify any of what I’ve said, then Google should be fine for checking it up. Whatever his flaws Christopher Tolkien has been pretty open about The Silmarillion, and all the relevant information is online.

  • ident

    I went to look for it since I know I’ve heard it more than once from more than one source, but the first source I found countered the notion that Tolkien did not want Christopher to publish The Silmarillion. There is no doubt, however, that The Silmarillion was not in a remotely publishable state. This is illustrated by Christopher Tolkien’s multi-volume series The History of Middle-Earth which covers the multiple versions of material in all of Tolkien’s published works and the massive amount of material that did not make it into The Silmarillion. Source: http://books.google.com/books?id=fyejYfCOpiQC&lpg=PA80&dq=Tolkien%20didn't%20want%20to%20publish%20silmarillion&pg=PA85#v=onepage&q=Tolkien%20didn't%20want%20to%20publish%20silmarillion&f=false

  • Percy Gryce

    Another great callback. You’re on fire, man.

  • Scottland559

    Wow! Advice on how to take a facial. Stop, please.

  • Paulo Pereira

    Why do you put ‘great’ in quotation marks?

  • Paulo Pereira

    The page the link goes to contains a sentence that says Tolkien WANTED his son to finish it. FInish it but not publish it?

  • Paulo Pereira

    I know most of that. I’m having trouble verifying that Tolkien didnt’ want it published.

  • Paulo Pereira

    I’m not questioning that Christopher was involved, it but that his father didn’t want him to publish it.

  • Paulo Pereira

    Why do you put ‘great’ in single quote marks?

  • Tyler AitchKay

    I can’t wait for a fan-edit that gets rid of all this crap that bogs down the film and makes it so weak and boring.

    It won’t fix that Reboot-tier CGI at the end of this one, though. My god.

  • Thomas Manson

    When Mike talks about “Tolkien fans” vs. “general audiences” being the only two types of people who watch this movie, he forgot one important audience – the “film major” audience.

    You know the guys; people who, whether or not they actually studied film in college, speak of the quality of the film in terms of framerate, cameras, production values, storytelling, conflict resolution, etc. If there’s a single deviance to the “Freitag’s pyramid” they will notice it. If they used a close up when they should have used a wide shot, they will pick up on it. They can tell who directed a film by the symbolism present and the camera moves used. And they believe all of these are essential elements of filmmaking, and that even if general audiences haven’t studied up on the subject, that if something is missing or “off-kilter” then they will subconsciously “pick up” on these things and will know if it’s a “bad” movie if these things are missing or not done well.

    In short, they believe that they are a form of “super” general audience who knows what general audiences like and want more than they do.

    That ain’t true, guys.

    General audiences want these things: tits, violence, explosions, and fart jokes. The more your movie has of each, the more they will sell. Remember “Idiocracy”? Remember the future society where everyone is mesmerized by movie called “Ass”? Well, the future is now.

    General audiences are frat boys and preteens and McDonald’s cashiers and housewives who don’t know or give a shit about any of the industry technique. Most people couldn’t tell a Super 8 from an IMAX camera. Most people don’t know what “falling action” is. They’re not analyzing the story. They’re not analyzing the production values. They just want to side boob and shit blowing up and somebody taking a leak.

    And it’s easy to neglect to mention the “film major” audience when you are one. Like I said, we tend to believe we are a subset of the “general audience” who are actually “in the know” as to why “us” general audiences like these good films so much.

    And Mike, let’s face it. That’s you.

    And that’s us as well.

  • SkyDog

    Most people watch movies, look at paintings, or listen to music in a holistic, first-impulse sort of way. It’s analogous to a magic trick, really (I think that’s a point Jay has brought up before?). A majority of folk don’t think about the individual elements of a work that need to collate in order to make the illusion of cohesion. They see a painting, and they don’t notice how the brushstrokes are angled and planned to fool the eye. They watch a movie, and it seems like everything happens just like it should, as if it were no different than life unfolding (people that cannot grasp the concept of a plot hole, for example). They listen to a song, and they don’t notice the repeating patterns and structures that are common to all music. They don’t see the moving parts fitting into place, they only see the illusion.

    Yeah, I realize I’m pretty smug.

  • TapewormBike

    Well, there are always false dichotomies and gross generalizations in reviews in order to make a point. Like here, where in reviewing an adaptation of popular book, you should try to see the point of “the purists”. However, no such ideal groups exist and the same goes for film majors (of course there are film majors, but you get what I mean).

    I never studied film, but I find all the information I can get about the craft enlightening and entertaining. I never thought though, that my relative lack of knowledge in that area disqualifies me from participating in a discussion about films, since they are art, open to all sorts of debating. Malaysian amputee lesbians would surely bring up some interesting points neither me nor you or Mike and Jay could come up with. The key word is individuality of experience and I try to respect it, even if it can be annoying to hear the arguments through popcorn laden spit. Personally, I would not throw all the audiences beside film buffs under the same Michael Bay driven bus.

    Now show me a sideboob and explode!

  • David Ben

    Okay, I’m way out of touch here. What was that Denny’s ad all about ?!?!

  • Thomas Manson

    Individuality of experience, schmindividuality of experience!

  • TapewormBike

    I just cum funny.

  • TapewormBike

    I am fucking myself, now that you mention it:)

  • ident

    No, I’m conceding that Tolkien intended his son to gather his works and publish them based on that source (until I can find a source that disagrees). I persist that the The Silmarillion was cobbled together from Tolkien’s writings extending back to WWI and was not intended to be the dense, meandering history book Christopher published.

  • Mark Bisone

    I just cum.

  • ident

    Denny’s is promoting the Hobbit with a promotional menu of awful food. When the first Hobbit came out, there was much lampooning of Denny’s Hobbit menu.

  • Mitchell Taco Nash

    I cum.

  • http://faddlechud.tumblr.com/ Faddlechud

    Also, I’d like to wish you a very merry Decemberween.

    And I’m also going to blow your mind when you realize that Senor Cardgage is the Plinkett of the Homestar universe.

  • Lemurfeature

    Well I for one can’t wait to The Desolation of Smawoooog.

  • Gangleri

    Fantastic as always, and it was nice to see Smaug get the Uhura treatment.

    One small but important point, however: PJ made the Hobbit movies for PJ fans, not for Tolkien fans. The latter tend to be willing to sacrifice the details to preserve the spirit, shall we say the narrative purpose, of the book and its characters, while the former would sacrifice both spirit and detail for the Middle-earth Experience (Tm) PJ has provided. Either that, or they confuse detail for spirit. In the LotR films, PJ tried to capture the meaning and thematic content of the books, usually successfully; that’s one of the reasons they were so well-received. Here, he tried to capture the feel of his own movies.

    Take the subplot with Kili, the morgul-arrow, and the athelas. A “Joe Audience” would likely find it unnecessary. A Tolkien fan might grumble that athelas can’t be found in Rhovanion, but he’d be chiefly annoyed that the entire subplot has nothing to do with the tone or purpose of the book. But a PJ fan would say, “OMG that’s what happened in the first trilogy!! How cool! This is so consistent and life-like! It’s like poetry – it rhymes.”

    Self-reference is great, as long as it’s subtle. If it’s heavy-handed or superfluous, it seems indulgent and smug (smaw-hug?). It happens constantly in these movies, and ironically in a three-hour movie, the book’s own content is rushed to accommodate PJ’s pandering fan-service (and his George Lucas-esque fondness for gratuitous Cirque-de-Soleil-style action).

    I guess what I’m saying is that genuine Tolkien enthusiasts often object to the extra material thrown in because it detracts from the plot, characters, and themes they love, even if the material has been culled from other Tolkien works. It’s the PJ fans who lap it up like thirsty dogs and then proffer their wallets.

  • Cameron Vale

    It was kind of a snuff thing.

  • The PwnUltimate

    He stuck around after the fight too, and even during the fight it wasn’t just a reference; the battle was more or less told from his perspective.

  • The PwnUltimate

    The Desolation of Smaug is not a LOTR movie.

  • The PwnUltimate

    I was under the impression that PJ didn’t have the rights to adapt The Silmarillion (or Unfinished Tales) and so the extra stuff from this trilogy is either original or adapted from The LOTR appendices. Was I misinformed?

  • The PwnUltimate

    It’s interesting that you say the dragon fight was too long, because in the book I found that fight to be agonizingly brief. There must be a happy medium here somewhere.

  • The PwnUltimate

    Azog wasn’t completely made up… was he? He just went from being dead to alive. The Goblins have a key role in the Battle of the Five Armies, so it’s not too crazy an addition.

    I admit I haven’t seen TDoS yet, so I can’t comment on how well it was done, but I certainly wouldn’t want the Necromancer subplot cut out. The fact that Sauron himself is in The Hobbit just to conveniently get Gandalf out of the way is one of the most frustrating things about the book, even if only in retrospect. The inclusion of such a subplot is one of the things I’d want most from a modern adaptation.

  • jklollololol

    The Transformers trilogy made about as much money as the original LOTR trilogy, and let’s face it, the LOTR trilogy was no Lawrence of Arabia: There wasn’t a single shot in the 9 hours that lasted more than 20 seconds. But these days we don’t just think a trilogy made by what looks like a kid with severe ADD and a lack of soul that made the Empire the best SW movie is, like, the bestest movie everrrrr!!!, but we get dumb-violent over it if someone calls it out for being a travesty; The fucking elf was snowboarding on a shield at half speed in the Two towers, enough said. Tom was right: the future is now. I didn’t see any transformers movie and I’m not going to see this in theaters, don’t try to lump me in with you and claim “It’s a bout individuality, maaaaannnnnn”. Fuck you, and fuck all of you pieces of shit who paid to see Star Wars after Phantom. You got the trilogy you deserved. And you’re getting the Hobbit trilogy you deserve too. Now keep acting like your diabetes and ADD isn’t because your, as Jack Johnson so perfectly put it, a “superficial, systematic, music television addict, check out my outsides there ain’t nothin’ in here!”…so caught up in the trends that the truth begins to bend and the next thing ya know, fuck, there ain’t no truth left at all…

  • strand0410

    IIRC, there WAS an Axog that killed Thorin’s grandfather but did not appear in events of The Hobbit, and probably died well before it. The depiction of the one-armed, big, white orc is also a Jackson creation. It’s the same deal with Legolas who has a prominent role in the movie. Jackson took a character from the lore (if not the book), and then altered them to his own liking. It isn’t necessarily bad, but these appearances aren’t canonical. Then there’s that second tier of movie characters like Tauriel and Lurtz who are entirely fabricated for the movie.

    I dislike all the Necromancer stuff. Jackson’s trying to make these movies LOTR prequels, which I think is a disservice to The Hobbit. They are such different stories with different tone, so when Jackson excises something like the light-hearted Beorn meeting just to cram more in more unnecessary Sauron shit, it just feels like he’s making LOTR-lite. There’s nothing wrong with making a kids movie out of a kids book like The Hobbit. Not everything needs to be grimdark.

  • strand0410

    I’d bold it, but I’m unfamiliar with Disqus’s text editor. It’s for emphasis, not sarcasm, as it’s the word you seem must hung up over. I think he’s a great director, while you don’t think so. We’ve both offered our points and agree to disagree. No drama.

  • Paulo Pereira

    I was just curious.

  • Paulo Pereira

    Maybe. I didn’t think it was meandering, though. I thought it was sell compiled, considering the circumstances.

  • ident

    If you consider the circumstances, it was compiled fine. Why consider the circumstances? Considering the circumstances of bad direction, bad script, bad acting, and bad production, The Room is a great movie.

  • The PwnUltimate

    Indeed, Azog wasn’t invented by Jackson, just re-imagined. I consider his appearance as one-armed and white to be acceptable for the sake of making Azog visually distinct from all other Orcs (even if the CGI wasn’t up to standard), not something that makes him a new character.

    This just seems to differ from person to person, as it does with the whole ‘too much LOTR prequel, not enough Hobbit’ complaint. I personally feel that – from AUJ at least – a good balance has been struck. The subplots are there to connect to LOTR (something spearheaded and partially achieved by Tolkien himself), but the story is still far lighter than the LOTR films, and can still be enjoyed on its own merits.

    I think if Jackson were prioritizing the ‘prequel’ aspect above straight adaptation, then there’s no way the stone giants and English-speaking trolls would make it in; they’re pure Hobbit whimsy if nothing else is.

    The movies probably are too long, though.

  • Jared Blando

    Bard the Bowman isn’t just “some guy”, he’s a direct descendant of the original ruler (Girion) of Dale (The town that was next to the Lonely Mountain) when it was destroyed. That why when he kills the dragon and they make him king, he feels lake town has a 1/14 claim on the gold since at least that much was plundered from Dale when it was destroyed. Thus setting the stage for the battle of five armies at the end of an excellent book. I love you guys, but saying Tolkien didn’t know what he was doing is a bit like saying Picasso or Rembrandt didn’t know how to paint. Just read the book or even Wikipedia once in a while and get your facts straight!

  • TapewormBike

    This is what I get for trying to be nice for once. Dude, first of all, chill the fuck out. Second of all, was I defending Prequels or even Hobbit for that matter? The point is that anyone can say “fuck this” to anything and it is hard to prove them wrong. I agree, the mainstream output sucks major ass. But blaming all the people is sort of dumb, since the ones following stupid trends and having ADD are the producers. Do you think that the population was more refined in the 70s? No, just the trends were different. And for that matter, now as opposed to 70s, you have so much choice – to see loads of “foreign” good movies (it feels weird saying foreign, when Im as far from US as one gets), well produced intelligent TV series, megafuckton of old movies accesible instantly and so on. I was not disagreeing with Tom, I was making a slight counterpoint. I will gladly disagree with you though. Kaka, I say, sir. Kaka.

  • TapewormBike

    Well, from the point of Middlle-earth history it makes sense, so, if you take it as a collection of “fake” mythological stories, it is ok. But in a narrative sense, when you have a hero set up (or several of them) and then almost out of the blue (in terms of the story structure) some guy saves the day, it does not feel satisfying and conclusive as it should.

  • Severnaya-Sheminahonda

    Nnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnneeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeerrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrddddddddddd!!!!

  • ident

    Tapeworm is right. Making sense logically doesn’t mean it makes sense dramatically.

  • ident

    How do you know why and for what audience Peter Jackson made these films? Do you have a source?

  • Yukonses

    Ouch. Tough conversation.

    Everyone should vote with their money, it sends a stronger message than just complaining on webzones. Get a good job and make more money, then you can send an even stronger message.

    Also, actively protect your brain from art pollution. If a bad movie is playing, just run out of the room. Don’t feel strange or unsocial, your brain is more important than that. Do what must be done.

    Oh and vote with your money. I can’t stress that enough.

  • TapewormBike

    I voted with my wallet once and they frown on you a lot, when you try to kick open the ballot box.

  • Yukonses

    I too enjoy these movies. I don’t mind Peter Jackson directing, though I wouldn’t have minded the change in vision for diversity’s sake. I don’t think they should have tried to mimic the epic nature of LOTR, the Hobbit just isn’t that big. A different director may have helped change the tone and pace of the Hobbit.

    My real beef is the stretching to 3 movies. 2 would have been perfect. And the original plan was to end the first movie with the barrel scene, a scene that generally everyone found exciting and fun. If there were 2 movies, I would have been fine with Jackson stuffing the extended editions with everything we see now. Shit, extend them to 5 hours each, I love it. But the theater needs a more efficient flow. Editing down to 2 films would have done it. That WAS the original plan after all.

  • Yukonses

    I don’t know about the rights, but The Silmarillion takes place thousands of years before the Hobbit and on a mythical continent (not middle earth). No stories there can be told in the Hobbit movies. What I do know is that material in the Silmarillion that mirrors LOTR and Hobbit plotlines are explored for more guidelines as to the meaning behind events or relationships.

    The biggest example being Aragorn and Liv Tyler’s relationship, an echo of a Silmarillion affair. Yes there are details of Aragorn’s relationship in the appendices of LOTR, but the film makers also looked to the Silmarillion version of the same tale for inspiration.

  • Wethewax

    Material from the Silmarillion is, I believe, mentioned in the LotR appendices, in fact some of it might be reprinted in whole.

  • Jared Blando

    It depends on what type of movie you are making and how loyal you want to be to the source material. The hobbit is a short book, but even thus it moves along quickly and has many set action pieces within the text that can/would easily be turned into comical/serious action sequences that would please an audience of wide diversity. My problem is that there should have been two movies, not three, and those two if made would need very little trimming since these movies essentially would film themselves. Peter Jackson is neither very loyal to the source material, nor is a he a very talented director when it comes to pace and tone, and his addition of other non-source material is unnecessary and at times completely absurd. We all know why he made three movies and stuffed them with filler, and that’s to make as much money as possible by using a household name to draw in more people. Had he followed the source material closer, these “Non logical” elements become quite logical, and would fall into place to make a fine action packed movie.

  • Wethewax

    The Silmarillion IS set in Middle Earth, in fact much of the Silmarillion is concerned with the creation of Middle Earth.

    Perhaps you are confusing Beleriand with this “mythical continent” you mentioned. Beleriand was a continent sized area of western Middle Earth that sank beneath the sea in a great catastrophe at the end of the 1st age.

  • Wethewax

    As I said before, after completing LotR Tolkien returned to the Silmarillion and found himself unhappy with his previous work. Although he tried to rewrite it, he never reached a point where he was happy enough with it to submit it for publication.

    Tbh, I don’t see any functional difference between “he was never happy enough with his rewrite to submit it for publication”, and “he didn’t want it published”.

  • Paulo Pereira

    Well, he wanted his son to finish it, according to the link ident provided.

  • Paulo Pereira

    I guess the bottom line is, I like the book. I really don’t know the circumstances since I wasn’t there but I think TS is chock full of good stuff.

  • super butt

    Yess yesssss let the butthurt flow through you

  • Yukonses

    You’re probably right.

  • Percy Gryce

    Cum.

  • 24601

    Great review. These guys confirm most of my initial reactions to movies.

    The last couple minutes is worth sitting through this whole thing.

  • Jay Stein

    You’re not smug,…you’re Smauuug…

  • Jay Stein

    sweet!

  • The PwnUltimate

    Thanks for the info! I was sceptical of Wethewax’s claim that The Hobbit had been “padded with material from The Silmarillion” for similar reasons. I did read somewhere that Christopher Tolkien had refused to sell the rights to The Silmarillion, but it’s possibly more likely that the asking price was just too high for the sake of some in-universe historical references. In any case, I interpreted Gandalf not remembering the blue wizards’ names in AUJ as a nod to Unfinished Tales.

  • Yukonses

    Don’t quote me on this, Wethewax may have better info than I. I’m just talking here. It’s been longer than I want to admit since I read these books.

    Oh, does an unfinished tale prove that Gandalf knows the blues’ names? Whatevs. I thought it was a stroke of genius to have Gandalf forget their names, be it in the Hobbit or not. I assumed that names were not anywhere in the text and the film makers wanted to mention them but not commit to hastily.

  • Mitchell Taco Nash

    This is basically a jerk-circle of cummen- er, comments.

  • Daniel Bakke

    I was kind of surprised they didn’t mention Peter Jackson’s multiple cameos in this one.

  • The PwnUltimate

    This is second-hand information until I get my hands on a copy, but it is my understanding that Unfinished Tales reveals what their names are, not necessarily whether Gandalf knows them. It just stands to reason that he would know their names, because there are only 5 Istari on Middle Earth, and Gandalf is one of them.

    Of course, it’s perfectly possible that Gandalf could forget, it just struck me that this was Jackson’s way of acknowledging the blue wizards without crossing any legal boundaries.

  • Yukonses

    That’s sounds right. I thought it was certainly within Gandalf’s character to forget. He does forget, we already know that. His brain is like a hard drive with only so much space.

    When I read what little info the books gave about Gandalf (this was a while ago), I think I concluded that this isn’t Gandalf’s first form. He seems as a man now and is concerned with man’s troubles, but may have been a just a spirit who is not so concerned with worldly titles and names. That was my take.

    Anyway, I’ll say again, I thought Gandalf not remembering the names was great. I laugh every time he delivers the line. Imagine how powerful this wizard would be if he could remember everything. It’s hilarious.

  • The PwnUltimate

    Yeah, that adds up. When he came back as Gandalf the White in The Two Towers, he’d spent an implicitly large amount of time out of his body, and he took a few moments just to recognize his own name. Maiar spirit or not, the Gandalf we know is still limited and fallible. I’m guessing this is why he can’t just use God Mode to shrink Smaug down to the size of a mouse or teleport the ring directly into Mount Doom.

  • ident

    I was also surprised they didn’t mention the obscure and only semi-relevant thing that I know, also. I know lots of things, too.

  • Mitchell Taco Nash

    “All of his movies have one or two, at least one or two instances of really shitty looking effects.”

    As soon as Jay said this my first thought was, “Yeah, just like that shitty obvious green screen from King Kong when they’re on Skull Island!” I actually went to pause the video to write this, but then they showed the exact scene I was thinking of when Jay ended his sentence. Those poorly done effects stand out so blatantly when everything else looks amazing.

  • Mitchell Taco Nash

    “It’s really well acted from both Morgan Freeman and Smaoaoauag.”

    Mike just completely ignores that joke from Jay.

  • Yukonses

    Peter Jackson is not loyal to the source material? And he’s not a talented director? And he’s a money-grubbing villain who secretly hates Tolkien?

    I had no idea. You’re destroying my perceptions of reality. And I just finished paying off this tattoo of Peter Jackson riding a dragon.

    But seriously, I understand some of your beef (why 3 movies?), but your conclusions as to what’s behind your beef is very wrong. Jackson is looking for money, he actually planned on 2 movies in the first place until the studio said “No, it will be 3 movies.” He pours over the source material and tries his damnedest to get it as OG as possible, but its the quality film maker in him that knows when to make a change. You don’t like the change? That’s a subjective opinion. I think the movies work. The box-office agrees with me. I’m very happy to get 3 more middle earth movies, no matter how divergent from the source material they may be. I already have the book. I don’t need another book on video. I need an awesome fucking movie that I want to watch again and again.

  • TapewormBike

    Anybody who watched the LotR extras can never acuse Jackson of being some dispassionate bussinesman with no respect towards Tolkien.

  • Yukonses

    Exactly. In fact, it’s kind of insulting to do so.

  • onenutdeep

    dildo faggins

  • onenutdeep

    i was slightly agreeing with your comments until i got to the….”box office agrees with me”….are you fucking serious? ….the box office agrees with “you”….

    your reliant on the fact that the masses (which mostly is made up deluded jackasses) shoveled out insane amounts of money for something to back up your statement…….?

    that like me saying lil wayne is shit on a donkeys testicle zit and you saying his “record” sales are the highest so he has to be a good “musician”.

    that like me saying mcdonalds tastes like oozing herpe boil on a faggot bums asshole and you saying their 32 billion dollar annual income says it tastes great!

    just cause something “works” doesn’t mean its fucking awesome….. your brain works enough to keep your basic motor funtions running does it make you a genius….no…….

    your comment agrees with me….hahaha

    oh hey! my fucking toilet works…..wow!!!!! it ammaaaaaaaazzzziiiiinggggg!!!!!!

    you can take a turd wrap it in some shiny stuff and stamp a logo that everyone knows and it will sell……. well you can polish the turd sir but its still a piece of shit.

  • Edward Stoller

    I didn’t notice until this review but these guys say “like” in almost every sentence.

    “It’s like… and I was like… but you know like… so like…like, like, like…”

    The dumbing down of the English language continues.

  • Sébastien St-Pierre Robert

    Haha, the ending was genius!

  • TapewormBike

    Dude, you took a tiny phrase, a statement that just said “I like it and lotsa other people seems to like it too” and made it into the guys main point. Come on. And for the record, my turd polishing business is tanking right now. Economy, I guess.

  • onenutdeep

    i definitely did not make it seem like it was his main point. I actually was nodding my head in agreement to most of what he said until i saw the statement.

    You may also need your brain re-calibrated….see I took that tiny phrase and i broke down how fucking retarded and ignorant it sounded. :)

  • Grant Butler

    I read the book a long time ago, it was shorter than any one of the LOTR books, so I really don’t see why it has been split over 3 films.

    I saw the first one but I cannot sit through it without being bored and falling asleep. I really hope someone does an edit and reduces these three movies down to one.

    Also I don’t want to sit for up to 3 hours watching a movie, an hour and a half is enough!

  • Mijk

    Sorry, I need to write stuff about Hobbit. Don’t care if you don’t care.
    I was among those who defended a 3 parter. It was way overblown, but if you complain about that, you need to know, that there is material by Tolkien, after Lord of the Rings was released to fit in the Hobbit, so it is not all PJ-made-up-bullshit…
    At least I thought so, until I saw the latest entry. If you have 3 movies, why would you cut so much from the original narrative? I had too much beer so I went to piss, soon after the movie started. I missed the mirkwood part completely (apart from the spiders, of course). Wasn’t there supposed to be this poisoned river, Bombur fell into…? Anyway, instead we have the story of Tauriel and Legolas… which is okay, I guess. What I really don’t like is, how hand-holding obvious everything is.

    These movies are nothing more than a way to tie in to Peter Jacksons adaptation of Lord of the Rings. Lord of the rings is everywhere. Summoning the eagles with a butterfly, Galadriel, Saruman (already evil… wasn’t that supposed to be a surprise?), the Ring is already very obviously ‘The One Ring’. They don’t even try to make that a prequel. It also diminishes the Lord of the Rings movies, when such ‘small’ adventure is shown on this scale. The final battle in part 3 will settle it once, and for all, for it will be 100 times bigger than the battle in Return of the King (which it wasn’t).

    If someone is going to read the Middle-Earth books, I usually suggest to start with the Hobbit, it really is a neat little book, which grows from a children story to an epic tale. Once you read Lord of the Rings, you don’t have to go back to the Hobbit.

    These movies where made to be watched AFTER you’ve seen Lord of the Rings.
    They could have made something new, here, but all I see is a huge pair of 3d Nostalgia Goggles.

  • Yukonses

    Whoa dude thanks! You just totally persuaded me toward your line of thought. I used to think that box office numbers determined if art was good or not. I used to think that the dumb masses knew what was best. My world has been turned upside down. Now I must reevaluate my movie collection in the light of this awesome revelation. Praise you, onenut.

    Yes its fun to pretend that box office numbers and dollar bills don’t decide to what film art our society is will be exposed. I hate the fact that 3/4 of the top ten highest grossing movies in a given year are general crap. It’s rare that ‘the box office agrees with me’ because it usually doesn’t.

    But I do take heart when something I approve of is doing well with the execs. Like it or not, those numbers determine if we’ll get more films like this or more films like Transformers. Box office numbers are why we get a shitty Star Trek sequel instead of a badass Dredd sequel. Learn why this happens and what really influences them. Don’t just write it off as ‘the system, man’. Pay attention to how things work, vote with your dollars, and promote the shit you like. Oh and get an education, the girlies like guys who can use big boy words.

  • Yukonses

    And on the topic of altering of the original material: In the first Hobbit movie after being told the tale of his warrior ancestor, Bilbo says something along the lines of “I believe you made that up.” To which Galdalf replies, “All good stories deserve embellishment.” This sort of serves as a defense to the filmmakers. It says that these are fake, mythological tales (so its ok). They are made more interesting every time they are told so they may live on.

    It’s like Iron Man 3 and the Mandarin. He tells the tale of the true origins of the fortune cookie. “Not really Chinese, hollow, full of lies, and leaves a bad taste in your mouth.” He says this as an analogy for America, but I took this as the filmmakers’ summary of what they planned to do with the Mandarin character. The Mandarin in the movie IS the fortune cookie.

    The point of this is that filmmakers must make management decisions about the source material. They’re smart enough to know what’s not going to work (for the most part). Good writers even will write in the explanation for why they made a certain choice. I understand why the above changes were made, they make it work.

  • TapewormBike

    I think that is pretty much right, yeah.

  • TapewormBike

    Exactly. And nice forward thinking (or hoping) from them, to leave that door open.

  • fred

    mooooon……..eeeeyyyyy……yyy…..

  • Yukonses

    Great points. Before I get into this, let me say that I like these movies. I’m glad they exist. But…

    I was disappointed in the lack of Mirkwood. One of the things I’ll always remember from the book was Bombur sleeping for like 3 days and the rest of the company having to drag his fat body through the woods. I would think that this is exactly the kind of trial that the dwarves should be facing in the movie version (especially the second installment). I think a movie like this would have benefited from the mysterious and fantastic threats of Mirkwood rather than the same ol’ pack-a-orcs on their trail.

    I too think it is a mistake to try and recreate the epicness of LOTR. You can’t so why in the hell would you try? It was an opportunity to change the tone of this trilogy to its own thing, but they seemed to have missed it. This jarring juxtaposition between the tone of the two stories is apparent in the film score (the LOTR epic queues don’t feel as appropriate anymore) and the addition of new monsters and villains. You can form tension in more creative ways. A hobbit is small, the book “The Hobbit” is smaller than LOTR (both in size and plot), so I think the Hobbit movies should be smaller or at least seen from a smaller point-of-view.

    There’s also the lack of physical threat (dwarves are indestructible), but I’m not going to bitch about that. There’s nothing wrong with having the ‘fool’ in action scenes, characters that survive strictly on unbelievable luck. This only works if the action is fun, though its easy to fall into the trap of suspended reality, losing the action to the world of boring because the viewer’s brain rejects the input.

  • deerstop

    I’m not even going to watch it… I hated the 1st part of this boring shit too much.

  • TJ

    Third watch through and I still haven’t figured out how they managed to go back in time to get young Rich Evans to play the first child.

  • Pebkio Nomare

    You know what, I just watched this and I have to say: You are both wrong. This is paced terribly. Especially the love triangle shit. When the movie was over… I heard the word “bullshit” ten times from different places around the theatre. And this is an audience that had a laughing fit over the fat jokes scene.

    I put on a little show for them… I turned to my friend and shouted out “Of course we couldn’t resolve the dragon thing! We HAD to see the dwarf love scenes! It wouldn’t have been ‘The Hobbit’ without that!”.

    The actual shit from the book, except for the Smaug seen, were SHORTENED! Three goddam hours and they trivialized the Beorn stuff. Three goddam hours and the murkwood scenes are rushed through.

    And then they dragggggggg oouuttttttttttt theeeeee loooooovvvvve sceeeennnneeees. Annnndddd theeeeee dwaaarrrrvvveeees fiiiightttingggg Smaaaauuuugggg sceeeennnneeees. Basically, all of the shit that Jackson made up to pad out three movies gets the most screen time and it got exceedignly fucking boring.

  • Pebkio Nomare

    I cannot impress upon anyone just how much I hate the love triangle thing. Can big film producers go one complete story without shoe-horning in a love story?

    Yahtzee put it best… this is like if we went to an alternate universe in which every movie requires a line-dancing competition. We’d think everyone there was batshit insane. But here we are, and there’s a love triangle bit taking up 20 minutes of a movie based off a book in which there wasn’t a single female character who had a name.

    So are you team Legolas or Team Whatshisface? I really can’t remember that guy’s name anyway, and I don’t care. It’s pointless! Where’s it leading? I know that Dwarf dies. Not a spoiler, it’s in the fucking book. The one good-looking dwarf dies. We also know how Legolas ends up so what is the point at all?

  • Domo_Konnichiwa

    Muc.

  • TapewormBike

    Well you are on a rant, but I must say, beisde Mike and Jay being wrong (opinion, they did not mind it, so how are they wrong), I totally agree.I still managed to like the movie, but I think you called some of my biggest beefs with it. I dunno, I like Jackson too, but the pacing is an issue in almost all of his movies.

  • Pebkio Nomare

    Oh, shut the fuck up, Ident. This is obviously his opinion you elitist dickhead. Did that look like a college dissertation to you? He stated what he thought.

    How about, instead of trivialising everything anyone says, you could maybe… actually… address what he said with some thought instead of some trollish “pics or it didn’t happen” bullshit.

  • Percy Gryce

    Mmm.

  • Yukonses

    I think you’re right about Jackson’s pacing. I remember how much King Kong was hurt by outta-place emotional scenes. Remember when Kong’s demolition of New York had to be paused for a long romantic ice skating scene with a female of a different species?

  • Pebkio Nomare

    Their thoughts are wrong! Their faces are wrong! Everything is wrong!

    Ironically, I liked everything about the LOTR movies. I sat through a marathon of all the extended cut movies once because I liked it that much. The pacing was actually great in those so I’m kind of confused how anyone in RLM could think the pacing was acceptable in DoS.

  • TapewormBike

    Fuck both of you guys, new BotW just dropped:)

  • Pebkio Nomare

    Oh really? Fuck all of us! Who cares about Peter Jackson and his millions of dollars? I’ll see you guys over in the BOTW thread.

  • ident

    It was a legitimate question. I am trying to learn things rather than jump to a wild conclusion. I can’t address what he has said until I understand the background that supports the whole supposition.

  • onenutdeep

    obviously you didn’t understand a single word i said….or the point of it.

    “YOU” sound like an arrogant misinformed dip shit when you try to use a statistic like “sale records” to back up something “YOU” like….. it’s sad ….you sound like a little fucking girl obsessing over crap like Justin bieber or purses,,,pretty pathetic.

    the numbers do not make movies good…..neither does many people liking it.

    and when did i say anything about a system? never even implied anything about a system….now your being a lying manipulating whore trying to twist what i say….yup….sounds like a teenage girl

  • Yukonses

    Yeah man, education. The lack of it really shows. You could turn your life around with just a little investment in your future. Girls will notice you for a change. Co-workers won’t laugh at you anymore. Your parents will lend you money again. I’m telling you, education. Do us all a solid.

  • onenutdeep

    either your a troll or a pathetic insecure person who spews wild assumptions that are untrue. (like religious people) … I’m not sure at this point. I’m completely convinced your one of the deluded jackasses i spoke of before.

  • Yezzir!

    I think it’s pretty clear that this story could have been told in a single film, which was the original intention. They lengthened it to create a sort-of LOTR prequel series. As a result, the first film sucked like nobody’s business.

    But I really enjoyed the second film. Yes, it’s too long, and yes, it’s action over substance. But, I did think that the Dwarves’ plight and struggle and desperation for a home, comes through much more in this film and carried the action for me.

    The scenes with Smaug, I thought were pretty amazing.

  • stryker1121

    I don’t mind the love triangle thing..it’s a break from the action and humanizes the narrative..that said I was bored with DoS and actually enjoyed the first film more. The Smaug scenes were mostly good but the middle sags with the extended Laketown scenes. Really put a pin the pacing and the movie never recovered, even when the company got to Smaug.

  • Pebkio Nomare

    Humanizes the narrative… it’s about dwarves traveling with a hobbit and a wizard through mystial lands filled with talking spiders and trolls and elves to go kill a dragon that talks to go claim a vast treasure horde and then fight in a war where a man turns into a bear to help in the fight that Giant Eagles took part in so that they could stop a massive army of goblins.

    The last thing we needed was the human element. Even in the book, they run into humans and the only thing they’ve got is that they suddenly kill the dragon and make the bowman their king. Then war.

  • mantaradio

    Did yall see Peter Jackson’s cameo in the first second of the movie, eating a carrot in Bree? In LOTR he had a cameo in Bree, too. So cute.

  • mantaradio

    Wait ok more importantly, what the fuck was that song playing over the credits!? it’s impossible to be too insulted by it, it totally dissolved away the ambiance, recontextualized my feelings for what was JUST on the screen and I’m imagining Thorin singing karaoke with Justin Timberlake or whatever and I mean, come on.

  • K D

    y?

  • MarioMCP

    I’m /very/ glad you all mentioned those weird shots during the barrel scene. I saw the movie on a random Tuesday or something, middle of the day, when both my brother and I had the day off. We went and saw it, it was just us a few other people. When the firs shot happened I turned to my brother and said out loud “what the fuck?”

    Some guy two rows down looked up at us and said “You all talking about that barrel thing?” he said, obviously referencing the same shot, and some chick called out from above us “it looked terrible!”

    It was one of the funniest moments I had in a theater, even if we were all being assholes and ruining the movie (…for the 2 other people who didn’t talk).

    I had no idea WHY they were in. They added nothing to the movie, or the scene. They were just jarring as fuck.

  • Wethewax

    How exactly does one “finish” someone else’s rewrite?

    If you handed me something you’d written, and asked me to rewrite it, fine. But ask me to FINISH rewriting it? How? I’ll rewrite it my way, you’ll rewrite it your way, but neither of us can “finish” rewriting the other’s work.

    When Tolkien asked his son to “finish” the Silmarillion, what that amounted to was asking him to rewrite things in his own voice, as well as create brand new material to fill in the gaps.

    Chris Tolkien has even admitted to having to GUESS what his father had intended in order to fill in some of the blanks.
    The truth is that we’ll never know how much of the Silmarillion is Tolkien Snr’s voice, and how much is Tolkien Jnr’s.

    But lets get back to the original jump off point for this debate,…the legitimacy of Peter Jackson’s adaptations.

    Here’s a brief excerpt from Chris Tolkien’s exclusive interview with Le Monde on July 9, 2012:

    “Tolkien has become a monster, devoured by his own popularity and absorbed into the absurdity of our time,” Christopher Tolkien observes sadly. “The chasm between the beauty and seriousness of the work, and what it has become, has overwhelmed me. The commercialization has reduced the aesthetic and philosophical impact of the creation to nothing. There is only one solution for me: to turn my head away.”

    “They eviscerated the book by making it an action movie for young people aged 15 to 25,” Christopher says regretfully. “And it seems that The Hobbit will be the same kind of film.”

  • Wethewax

    “Thanks for the info…” DIS-info would be more accurate.

    As I said in response to Yukonses post, the Silmarillion is not only ABOUT Middle Earth, the early parts of the book are actually about the CREATION of Middle Earth.

    In fact there’s a big giveaway at the end of The Silmarillion, because it’s last “book” is titled “Of the Rings of Power and the Third Age”, which gives a brief history of the creation of the Elven Rings of Power, Sauron’s betrayal and creation of The One Ring, the doom of Isildur, Gollum’s possession of The Ring, it’s subsequent re-finding by Bilbo, and then a potted version of LotR.

    And, as I said before…AGAIN, some of the material in the appendices of the larger editions of LotR, is ALSO featured in the Silmarillion.
    So whether it comes from the Simarillion, or the LotR appendices, it’s the same material.

  • Yer_Mum

    Overall I liked the hobbit:The desolation of Smuag, however there are just so many issues with the film that could have been so easily changed.
    1. The love triangle is completely useless, pain in the ass Hollywood bullshit
    2. Legolas is to perfect, the audience know that Legolas dosn’t die, his action scenes have no tension, you could try and make the audience forget this by having him be in some believable danger but no, hes invincible apparantly
    3.There making the book into three movies, and yet they cut stuff out of the book that isnt in the film (the black lake in mirkwwod sequence)
    4.Beorn (the bear guy) has a tiny part, what happenes in the book is way more badass, and yet they make some bullshit history between him and Azog, for a back-story bilbo could have asked about Beorns people and Gandalf could have
    grumbled (the history of Beorns people is a long and sad tale, and i do not think it appropriate to recount it in his hall) or some shit like that
    5. some fo the CGI was unfinished
    6. The ending is pointless, we the audience know that the dwarves convoluted plan wont kill the dragon, so then whats the point devoting 30 minutes to this
    7. That fucking go pro
    8. Legolas jumping on dwarf heads…
    9. Bards introduction, why couldn’t the dwaves just float to laketown and sneak around for a bit and Brad is a mysterious guy who follows them (or maybe captured them, he could be a city guard) and then he comes forward and makes his speech about the dwarves greed, DRAGON FIRE! etc

  • EXbob

    I really enjoyed the first Hobbit film but this one had me utterly bored. The action formula has of “Oh no we’re about to die” then being saved by Elves has been so overused at this point it’s mind numbing. For me I just wanted more character development, easily the best part of the film was the scene with Kili talking about the rune stone, that was really well done. I also love 48fps, I think it should be the norm just without the 3D.

  • Mac

    Still no Catching Fire yet? Come on! :(

  • RAGESLAY

    IT’S A WYVERN, YOU HACKS!

  • Curios1

    The book “The Hobbit”, is far inferior to any of the Lord of the Rings books. Naturally the films will be the same. And making a 310 page book into three (long) movies is really stretching it too far. The Lord of the rings books were all around 500 to 600 pages.

    It is obvious that Tolkien developed Lothr when writing the Hobbit. It inspired him to take it all to the next level.

  • Curios1

    Also, the Hobbit movies seem to suffer from the same CGI bias as many other modern remakes/prequels/restarts etc. In the past, lacking CGI, filmmakers made creative decisions to limit the amount we actually see of the monster/world/magic etc. Keeping the mystery is often much more compelling.

    The Gandalf and Sauron sequence were very cool, but it was a little too long, just a little. And the first Hobbit sometimes felt like a theme park ride.

  • Wethewax

    Having watched them myself I would criticise whoever it was that ruined Gimli’s character for being a total shithead!

    Gimli is the toughest bastard in Middle Earth, PJ turned him into a flatulent idiot.

    Aaaannnddd….PJ’s attempts to humanise Gollum are idiotic. He’s a cannibalistic psychopath, why are you trying to make the audience feel sympathy for him?

    I don’t know how cynical PJ is, but he’s quite happy to piss on the spirit of LotR when it suits him.

  • Wethewax

    Yeah, you’re right. That guy should write a letter of apology to PJ right now.

    Or…you could stop being so melodramatic, and learn that just because you like something it doesn’t follow that said thing is without fault.

    Oh, btw, saying “the box office agrees with me” sounds totally hollow when you follow it up by talking about how rarely the box office agrees with you.

  • Wethewax

    “I’m very happy to get 3 more middle earth movies, no matter how divergent from the source material they may be.”

    2 days before you posted the above, you posted this:

    “I don’t think they should have tried to mimic the epic nature of LOTR, the Hobbit just isn’t that big. A different director may have helped change the tone and pace of the Hobbit.

    My real beef is the stretching to 3 movies….”

    The more I read of your posts, the more you sound like a troll.

  • TapewormBike

    Or he just made some part interesting. Gollum is consistently the best part of these movies and I do not think it would be so, if he was just a plain maniac.

  • Yukonses

    I think you’re right. When I read my past posts out of context, I seem to be an inconsistent asshole. How can someone agree that 2 movies would have been smarter, but also be glad that there are 3 more middle-earth movies? No decent person can be this complex. There’s only one possibility: I’m a troll.

    This actually sucks because I’ve enjoyed your input in the past. You seem to know what you’re talking about when it comes to the source material. You’ve had some great opinions with which I can agree. Then at other times, you seem to attack people for whatever reason. And that’s regrettable. You could persuade more readers to your viewpoint without the stone throwing.

  • Paulo Pereira

    All well and good, but I don’t know how it answers the question of whether publishing TS was against Tolkien’s wishes.

  • The PwnUltimate

    OK, fair cop, but my point was that you can’t really say The Hobbit movies were “padded with material from the Silmarillion” if Jackson could have never read The Silmarillion and still achieved the same result.

    Besides, if the only parts of The Silmarillion which were adapted were also in The Lord of the Rings, doesn’t that make the fact that The Silmarillion had parts not intended for publication by JRRT irrelevant? Christopher Tolkien’s embellishments won’t make it into The Hobbit, because Jackson doesn’t have permission to adapt them.

  • Wethewax

    Please point out one of the other “attacks” that I’ve made on people.

  • Grant Butler

    This film was shit…

    – No sense of physics, it just feels like a super hero cartoon
    – Legolas and Kate from Lost just feel so OP and they ruin any tension from the scene because they can just kill everything with no effort
    – The CGI is over used and the switching between CGI and sets look like crap and I hate CGI orcs, it just makes them use them as throw away enemies, waves and waves of them and they draw out boring fight scenes because of it.
    – Where is the Hobbit?
    – Why are the Dwarves so useless? All the time it’s the Hobbit that is meant to be useless getting the useless Dwarves out of trouble. Like how did the Spiders capture them all without a fight? Yet as soon as the Hobbit frees them, they suddenly become amazing with no weapons.
    – Why is the Dragon really smart and then just becomes really dumb? Like makes no sense other than an excuse for him to lose…
    – The Barrel scene breaks the law of physics and is over long and stupid. I hate the whole Legolas standing on them thing, like he is more powerful than water as he can keep them Barrels floating together…

    I HATE IT, MOVIE SUCKS.

    How did they go from LOTR to this shit?

  • Wethewax

    “…Whether it comes from the Simarillion, or the LotR appendices, IT’S THE SAME MATERIAL.”

  • Wethewax

    I explained myself in some detail, you seem to have a short memory.

  • Grant Butler

    There wasn’t even a love triangle..

    It was Legolas being jealous and a tad bit stalker of the attraction between Kate and the Dwarf guy.

  • Wethewax

    In the book he’s a cannibalistic psycho that we’re meant to hate.

    In the film he’s a cannibalistic psycho that we’re meant to sympathise with.

    The one feature that doesn’t change is that he’s a cannibalistic psycho.

  • Yukonses

    Well I got 2 in the span of minutes, but that’s ok because you
    had to put me in my place or something. You’ve been self-righteous with your opinion and melodramatic about the opinion of others (the 2 things you accused me of).

    So search your own soul. Find your own faults. Put some “quotes” around them to make them especially damning. I’m not going to waste one more second on what was obviously your bad day.

    Overall, I stand by my statement: You’ve got decent viewpoints with which I often see myself agreeing. Be my buddy or leave me be.

  • TapewormBike

    And thoroughly fuckable

  • Wethewax

    So you got 2 messages from me that you felt were harsh, and somehow you managed to misrepresent that as me attacking people in general. Such self importance.

    I don’t believe you want to be “buddies”, nor do I wish to be “buddies” with you, because all the evidence suggests that you are a self important ignoramus, who scores high in glib rhetoric, but low in basic research.

    Now run along back to telling people how your views represent the baseline of all that is reasonable.

  • The PwnUltimate

    Right, is your complaint that The Hobbit shouldn’t be padded with material NOT FROM THE HOBBIT, or is it that The Silmarillion in particular is an inappropriate source?

    Because if it’s the former, then that’s fine. If it’s the latter, then I already went over why that can’t possibly be an issue.

  • Paulo Pereira

    I read what you wrote but I didn’t see a source to support it.

  • Paulo Pereira

    Yeah, the story was supposed to be told from the POV of the hobbit. Hence, the title, THE HOBBIT.

  • Michael Haas

    Mike: “While each child sits there unsuspectingly, it leaves them vulnerable to this…” *reaches for the kid’s ass*

    Until I saw that he grabbed a wallet, I was pretty creeped out…

  • Akercocke Jones

    I just got out of the movie. Enjoyed it overall, but yeah, Peter Jackson may have botched the ending, when it comes to general audiences. Every single person in the theater was pissed and disappointed at the ending. You could hear a collective groan of displeasure.

  • Paulo Pereira

    I read what you wrote but it sounds like conjecture on your part. And then you went off on a tangent.

  • Mister_Misinformed

    God this Mormon ad at the top of the page is annoying.

  • Paulo Pereira

    He developed LotR after TH. The publishers wanted a sequel and LotR is what he came up with.

  • Paulo Pereira

    I’m with you. Especially the part where Tauriel heals Kili. YAWN!!!

  • Paulo Pereira

    And weren’t we already subjected to Bard and his annoying brood for the human element? For that matter, Tauriel and Kili aren’t even human.

  • theaquanaut

    The problem is when people like you don’t understand Tolkien lore.
    Elves in the lore are OP by nature, this is actually how they fight and
    are, super human beings; orcs are even mutated elves. This is a
    non-valid complaint. It was only due to restraints that this could not
    be done in the original trilogy.

    Complaining about the Hobbit
    means you ultimately don’t get the whole point of the large beginning of
    the first movie. It’s never been about Bilbo, it was the journey, the
    tale that he personally went through. Jackson had some liberties I admit
    where i believe he went wrong but you didn’t have to have Bilbo in
    every scene.

    Every other point, about the ridiculousness of the
    barrel scene, how it breaks the laws of physics… You realize this is a
    fairy tale story, right?

  • Dane Corle

    Yeah, some genuine criticism there. I take issue with some of them, though.

    1. Not really a love triangle. Tauriel’s presence gives Kili and Legolas some much-needed characterization. It provides a major contrast to how Legolas was in the LOTR trilogy and lets us get to know Kili a bit more (which we’ll need for the third movie).
    2. To you and me, maybe. To anyone who’s never seen LOTR or future generations that’ll watch these movies in chronological order when they see them for the first time, not so much.
    6. There’s a major difference between the “movie” dwarves and the “book” dwarves, especially with regards to Thorin. “Movie” Thorin is much more in line with his portrayals by Tolkien in the appendices, and it would seem *really* out of character for Thorin, or even for the dwarves when clumsily recontextualized by Tolkien in his later works, to just hide from Smaug and not take the fight to him. Also the film needs a climax, even if it’s a botched climax where the heroes don’t succeed (Empire Strikes Back). Also, not everyone seeing the movie has read the book, so a lot of them don’t know that Bard kills the dragon.
    8. *shrugs* Eh… he’s an elf. It’s no more or less outrageous than some of the stuff he did in the previous films.
    9. Wow, for real? I thought his intro in the film was amazing. Agree to disagree on that one.

  • Dane Corle

    Gonna disagree on that one. These Hobbit movies *needed* to be more than one movie. Maybe not three, but definitely at least two. The Hobbit’s narrative structure is way different from how Tolkien wrote LOTR. The Hobbit is very fast-paced and very episodic, with lots of unrelated adventure set pieces happening in rapid succession. This is one case where I think stretching it out was warranted or even necessary, because a screenplay for just one movie would’ve lead to a disastrous sketch of a film.

  • Dane Corle

    Eh, that kind of undermines the bulk of Tolkien’s themes, which I think the film captures fairly well. Besides, do we REALLY want Kili to be a totally blank slate before his (spoilers) presumed death during the Battle of Five Armies like he was in the book? I certain know *I* would like to actually *feel* something when he dies rather then just the “meh” the book got outta me.

    The film does a good job of telling the story of the book when properly contextualized by the last few chapters of the book along with the larger bulk of Tolkien’s work, and yes, that includes the humanization of the narrative. ‘Cause ya gotta admit, when ya go back and read the book from beginning to end its obvious Tolkien didn’t know where the story was going, cause certain things just don’t add up upon rereads.

    Tolkien scholars are basically in agreement, if Tolkien knew from the beginning how he was gonna kill Smaug then he would’ve introduced Bard far earlier in the narrative and built him up more, rather than just introducing him when the narrative required him, which the movie does. Same goes for Kili’s characterization. And yeah, it comes at the expense of shortening some other moments that were *actually* from the book, but I’m okay with that.

  • Robby

    That’s interesting, because I took my younger brother to the midnight premier, and people in the theater were chuckling at the end

  • Andrey Tarkovsky Reference

    “My left name is tremendous savings, Ms. America!” — Senor Cardgage

  • Pebkio Nomare

    Wait wait wait. I almost took your argument with just “well, I would’ve liked to have heard that from Tolkien himself.”. But then, I pulled it back by it’s dangling thread because it’s crazy. That is a crazy thing you’re trying to tell me.

    He would have changed it if he had known earlier? Earlier in what, a chiselled stone? It’s a book, and not even that long. Did he release this 310-page narrative episodically? Was it a webcomic way before it’s time? Did he have no plan for how he was going to kill the main enemy of the story until the end and then was all like “Oh shit I messed up and I can’t change it at all! It’s stylistically designed to be that way but I can diminish it’s effects…”

    That’s too insane to believe.

    As for your first paragraph… sorry, but I DON’T need importance assigned to a person who dies to feel the tragedy of that death.

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  • Dane Corle

    Well there is a reason Tolkien never really finished the Silmerillion before his death. It’s because he later developed a habit of completely scrapping entire drafts and starting over again from scratch when he wasn’t satisfied with them or didn’t think it would add up correctly. There was a long period when Tolkien quit writing The Hobbit and he was in a real different mindset when he picked the story back up again. It’s no coincidence that the book takes on a radically different tone from Chapter 10 onwards. What starts as a simple children’s tale about a wizard, a hobbit and some dwarves going on a treasure hunt quickly becomes a story about a king reclaiming his lost homeland, the idolatry of wealth, the corruption of greed, the escalation of vengeance, the tragedy of war, etc.

    A lot of people say that he wrote The Hobbit for his children, but that’s not quite accurate. It’s more accurate to say that he wanted to write a book his children *would read* because he thought writing a fantasy novel as a children’s book was the only way he could get it published and sold. A conclusion he later regretted upon reevaluation.

    And no, yeah… feel free to read his letters to C.S. Lewis and other literary friends and colleagues. There was a LOT of stuff in this book that he really hated and he wanted to redo, especially with the first half. Not only because it was pretty inconsistent with the larger canon of Middle Earth in general, but also because it wasn’t very consistent with itself. In fact he started rewriting the book some time in the 60’s, which he later abandoned due to the insistence of his friends and colleagues. Props for not “Lucasing” up his creation that a lot of people loved, though I doubt he’d have slowly annihilated the earlier editions because it “wasn’t his true vision”.

    But yeah, a lot of people who professionally study his work are pretty darn sure a revised The Hobbit would’ve included an earlier introduction to Bard. Love it or hate it, there is a well-founded precedence, perhaps even from Tolkien himself, for a lot of the changes Jackson made to the story. Not all, but a lot.

  • omgnoway

    That’s interesting you guys say you liked the Golem scene in the first one since I hated it. That seemed to go on for an hour, but in this 2nd one, I liked the Dragon scene a lot, but yes, that too went on a little long, but it could easily be my favorite scene as well. I was so sick of Frodo and Sam and all those characters (also Golem, I dislike him a lot), except maybe Gandalf, that I didn’t care what happened to them so it really hurt my LotR experience. Sure the films look great, but who cares if you don’t like the main characters? In these Hobbit films, it’s funny you mention how the actual Hobbit doesn’t have much screen time which I thought as well, but I care about what happens to him and to the dwarves. I like how he uses the ring, but at the same time tries not to since he knows it makes him feel bad. I loved the barrel scene, the spider scene. Didn’t even mind the love triangle, though it seemed out of nowhere, it was done subtly enough that it wasn’t over-dramatized. The Elf King was a crazy looking douche, which seemed appropriate. The guy who turns into a bear was cool and I wish he was in it more. The scene where they all start tripping out in the woods was funny and well done. All the scenes with Gandalf finding the mysteries of the darkness interested me, especially when he fights it for that brief moment (though not sure why they put him in a cage…) Overall, I want the dwarves to get their home back, since the ACTING actually shows up (something I thought lacking in the LotRs films) and makes me want them to succeed, rather than some annoying hobbits and an even more annoying Golem trying to throw a ring in a volcano. The best thing they did was not have Golem, that alone gives this movie high marks for me.

    The only negatives I have is I also thought some of the movie didn’t look done at times, with shoddy CGI and rushed looking sets, but that’s nitpicking really. I’ve really liked these Hobbit films more than LotR, and I know I’ll get flack for that, but it’s true.

  • Dane Corle

    I’m gonna hafta defend Gandalf summoning the eagles with a butterfly. Gandalf in the original The Hobbit is a cooky old wizard who knows a few magic tricks. Gandalf in Tolkien’s later works is practically a demigod. Retelling The Hobbit in that context, it seems odd that Gandalf could be done in by a few wargs while hanging off a tree. Gandalf actually *summoning* the eagles makes the eagles be there of his own volition, whereas in the book they just show up ’cause he got lucky.

    It does run the risk of just coming off as being derivative of LOTR, but it’s a minor touch I really appreciated.

  • Pebkio Nomare

    WAIT! That’s a completely different argument. “He wanted to revise the story after some time” is not the same as “he would’ve given Bard a better introduction if he knew how Smaug was going to die”.

    And I know the story of the Silmerillion. Tolkien was asked to write a sequel and the first version of the Silmerillion was what he turned in… but they didn’t except it because they wanted another hobbit story. I can’t remember the publisher… huh…

    Anyway, the gist of your argument is that, like George Lucas before him, J.R.R. Tolkien would’ve changed all the stuff in his wildly successfull book? Well, you know what…

    Irrelavent.

    His book was popular because the way it was written. Not because of the way he felt about it, or what he wanted to change. The book. Was Popular. Because of what was in the book.

    Thinking about Lucas… these actually feel like the prequel movies a bit. The directing is better, sure, but they’re focusing on the love plot and character stories and adding importance just because of established importance in later stories.

    Holy crap! These are the Star Wars Prequel Movies for Lord of the Rings!

  • Pebkio Nomare

    I just posted this as a reply but it’s important enough to restate. I have had an epiphony about these movies. There are many simularities of them to another trilogy for which RLM has documented dislike. Particularly the second movie:

    There is a heavy focus on the love story
    Most of the scenes are character-driven stories
    The scenes that aren’t are just so dense
    Every single image has so many things going on…
    The Elves are pretty much Jedi
    There is a lot of reliance on cgi
    They add importance to events only because of importance established in later movies
    They are prequels

    —The Hobbit Trilogy is a better-directed fantasy version of the Star Wars Prequel Trilogy.

    They’re certainly not as bad, but they have the definite feel of being a blown-out-of-proportion character-driven important-because-of-an-already-made-trilogy set of movies.

  • Pebkio Nomare

    In fact, let’s look at the necromancer scenes.

    If you had somehow failed to see the Lord of the Rings movies, then the reveal of Sauron would be a bit confusing. The release of the nine; the eye turning into a person turning back into an eye; the ogres doing… something.. with him; none of that would make much sense.

  • Dane Corle

    The fact that Tolkien wanted to revise the book ties into my previous point. I was just using that as an example, not as summary of the core of my argument. And I’m not saying you have to like it, I’m just saying there’s precedence for it. A literal translation of The Hobbit from book to film just wouldn’t work within the larger context of Middle Earth canon, nor would it’s narrative structure or pacing make for a very good movie. This is just one of those cases where I think stretching things out and making changes from the source material is an absolute must.

  • Pebkio Nomare

    Wow, that’s completely why the Elves won the upcomming war against the humans and dwarves in about 5 minutes.

    No, I remember it very specifically. The elves completely wasted the humans and elves and then the told the eagles to piss off and then knocked Byorn out AND THEN sat around for a while waiting for the Orcs to show up before slaughtering everything twice.

    No wait, that didn’t happen, which Lore were you talking about again?

  • bretweir

    Best dragon I’ve seen in a movie since Dragonslayer… I like that it had 2 legs and wings like a bat… not 4 legs AND wings (like the stupid dragon heart movie).

  • Mijk

    I wrote this almost 3 weeks ago.. I am afraid I was a little harsh on the whole thing. I got the Extended Cut for Christmas and saw all these making of stuff, which I really loved when the LotR EE came out. It is the same thing here. I liked the Extended cuts (yes.. I don’t care if they spent almost an hour before the adventure starts). And I saw that these movies where made with a sympathetic cast (I really grew fond of all the dwarf actors) and PJ, though shining with smugness, made it clear where certain decisions in changing the story came from. -Spoilers- I also heard that Saruman might come back and actually be a ‘good’ wizard, in the 3rd movie. I have yet to see Desolation again… but if I do so, I might be in a more forgiving mood.

  • Name Namerson

    Take a drink every time they say, “What’s that guy’s name?” or “I don’t remember what happened.”

    This should be called “Mike and Jay Pretend to Not Know Anything About the Biggest Movie of the Year Because I Guess It’s Too Geeky Or Something.”

  • ikilledacat

    Couldn’t agree more. I may be the only one who despised all of the LotR movies, except for the first one. Couldn’t get behind the absurb romantic love triangle, way too much walking/not enough plot development, and unneccessary charas (Pippen) getting way too much screen time. Thankfully, the Hobbit movies are far superior imho as the subplots are far more interesting. However, there are some flaws esp with the lack of characterization. We seem to know way too much about the oakenshield dude, but everyone else lacks any development. So it really feels like a chore to sit through 3hrs of glamour shots when I could care less about the charas, that also appear to be invincible (until now, none of the charas have even been minorly injured). I also got frustrated that Gandalf abandoned the group so he can walk forever to some dangerously precarious location to have 5 sec convo with the birdshit wizard just to go to another far off location only to send the wizard away (wtf!?). I’m sure as always though, Gandalf will magically arrive in the perfect time just as he’s needed to save the day (smh). But still, these movies are impressive and awe-inspiring, but they all have the same failings that make them a chore to sit through.

  • Bad Andy

    LOTR movies were great, but, I greatly prefer The Hobbit series! Smaller sets, tighter cast and more focused on smaller events.

  • GraphicsAndBeer

    I agree with the line “I want to see less of the Hobbit”. I just got done listening to the unabridged book, then went to see the movie (mistake).

    Fuck the weird shit PJ put in this movie. And what the fuck was up with the gold gummy bear dwarf statue? Really WTF was that?! Fuck the book, books are for assholes. Why not just have like 100 storm troopers come in and shoot at the dragon, then they can be killed. Why not, fuck it… fuck my groin.

    Really the only added stuff I thought was a good addition was the Bard stuff. Don’t get me wrong I would give it to Kate, but she was not needed. But I would give it to her in many ways… holding on to those pointed ears… oh yes.

  • ident

    I’ve read the books, including The Silmarillion, and I had trouble remembering the names.

  • ident

    Unnecessary chakras bring down the whole movie.

  • ident

    Jones went to a general screening and you went to a midnight premiere. I think the reason for the different reactions is clear.

  • ident

    Until I saw that he grabbed a wallet, I was pretty turned on…

  • ident

    It’ll be on Best of the Worst in ten years. Wait ’til then.

  • wheany

    The Hobbit: The Desolation of Smaug: Much ado about nothing.

  • Pissernacht

    CUNTING HELL! You can fucking type “characterization”…

    …yet not “character?”

    Why do you do that!?

  • Kyle

    Ha ha, they brought back the anal beads from Wheel of the Worst with Where Did I Come From? That was so funny.

  • Kyle

    It’s not fair to say Bilbo just stands around. He does more than anyone. He saves the dwarves from the spiders and sweet-talks Smaug and everything.

  • Kyle

    Yes you can fault this movie for the visuals! The CG looked embarrassingly unfinished in several places. How can you say Peter Jackson was saving his money for the ending? The ending sequence looked the worst.

  • Kyle

    No you weren’t right on the money about the barrel sequence! Your prediction was “Oh no! We’re going over a waterfall.” But the over-the-top unbelievable action in that sequence surpassed everybody’s expectations.

  • Rob

    What they were right on the money with was the long, drawn out action scene during the barrel sequence. However, you’re right stating that it surpassed everyone’s expectations. It was a wonderfully orchestrated action set piece.

  • Kyle

    Dude, the Hobbit movies give the dwarves as much characterization as possible. In the books the individual dwarves have no character whatsoever. They’re always just together as a group doing the same things at the same time.

  • Memoman

    Half in the baggins!

    Am I the first to use that joke? In the world?

  • jimmy

    I finally watched this yesterday, and I thought it was overrated. Everyone was saying it was better than the first. Definitely not. It was the most padded movie I’ve ever seen. I still kind of liked it for some parts. I probably didn’t like it as much because I was tired as fuck while watching it, but 8.1 on IMDB? Are people fucking retarded? I would give it a 6 out of 10, but I feel like that’s generous.

  • http://ima420r.com Bryon Bougie

    I thought there was too much missing from the book. Movies don’t need to follow the book work for work, but some of the best parts of the book are missing and that’s a shame.

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  • Scarilian

    To me it just looked and felt like a video game cut scene.

  • sepiajack

    Agreed, I actually really liked the first one, except for the 2nd unnecessary climax at the end where they are all hanging off the tree, but this was the first Lord of the Rings movie I felt disappointed by, way too much filler.

  • jimmy

    The first one is among my favorite movies, albeit a bit far down on the list, but the second one? Naw.

  • Valar

    Sounds exactly like a person who knows they would not have a chance in hell with her.

  • Jack Park

    I agree with all the reviews these guys do, except this one.
    I HATED this movie. I really did think it was crap and cartoony.
    Peter Jackson is just going down hill. I enjoyed LOTR (especially 2) but I didn’t watch hobbit 1. This movie killed my desire to see any other LOTRish films.
    I hated the spider scene especially, because it wasn’t fun, it could have been cut from the movie and it wouldn’t have made a difference. Also the barrel role (so fucking stupid, like a donkey kong video game) and the molten gold scene. I was just whispering to myself and my friends “use your fire, HES RIGHT THERE!!!! GET HIM!!!” Smaug started cool, but he ended dumb and kind of un intimidating.
    peter Jackson is PADDING it all because he wants to make 3 epics. This move could have been 1hour30mins and be soooo much better.

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  • SkaMP

    What I liked about the hobbit movie is seeing more stuff happen in the LOTR universe but pretty much everything else is just terrible. Like you described it’s so fucking cartoony, .. I’m not even gonna list ALL the terrible things about this movie but it’s just so.. ugh.
    All the action was so fucking boring cuz there was no tension, no one is going to die, whatever happens. they can fall 1000 metres down a gorge, dance on the nose of a dragon, get surrounded by 20 wargs, float on molten gold.. just ugh.
    I agree on one part though; I really liked most of the Gandalf stuff, much more realistic and some actual tension.

    You know the expression on Rich Evans’ face while he watched the Robocop trailer? I had the same expression on my face during MOST of The Hobbit (and The Hobbit 2)

  • SkaMP

    Do you also like how Jackson turned Smaug into a joke? Great and magnificent? dangerous? don’t kid me he can’t even kill a single dwarf

  • SkaMP

    Using molten gold to ¿kill? a dragon.. someone pls explain why ayone would think a dragon would even be phased by molten gold.. for a dragon that must be be just like someone throwing water in someone’s face.. what is it supposed to do? to a fucking fire breathing giant lizard..

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  • Mads Bolding Fenger Poulsen

    The difference between his take on Star Wars and Star Trek is that he
    isn’t a genuine Star Trek fan, and for that reason he decided to make
    the new adaptation into Star Trek for the masses.
    He has stated many
    times that he is a fan of Star Wars, and it seems to me that he can
    make stuff that he cares about interesting. In Star Trek he cared about
    action and visuals. In Star Wars he will hopefully care about the story
    as well. I hold myself slightly optimistic.

  • Justin Lee

    Hahhaha Hobo Baggins lmao

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  • sonicjrjr14 .

    Why do you guys hate the Star Trek movies so much?

  • sonicjrjr14 .

    Have you seen the prequels? JJ will be an improvement, honestly.

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  • Valar

    There is a great film called “The Hobbit” buried amongst all the crap that was thrown at us for three hours. I envision a fan edit where: 1) The entire Necromancer subplot is cut out 2) The overstuffed action sequences are trimmed 3) The Smaug vs. Bilbo scenes are trimmed 4) The final showdown between Smaug and the dwarves is lost, or changed in some way that the stupid “flooding him with gold” scene is changed to another way to poss him off if the film still needs a climax. That way we have a two-hour film that gets right to the point and never loses focus.

    I actually liked the Tauriel/Kili subplot, including her following him to Laketown, it slowed the story down for awhile and they had some good chemistry.

    One day someone will condense the trilogy from nine hours down to six hours or so, and it will be vastly improved for the effort.

  • Jack Longthorp

    I doubt it’s anything personal, those films are just utter trash is the thing.

  • sonicjrjr14 .

    But how? I’ve seen them and loved them, and based on their Metacritic scores critics seem to think they’re the best Star Trek films.

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    You know what wouldve been a better idea for the barrel scene while still having a big fight scene: bilbo and the dwarves hide in the barrels, meanwhile the orcs are trying to get into the elf place through some hidden entrance to get the bilbo and the dwarves and the elfs fight them off, with the elves distracted now bilbo and the dwarves have the opportunity to escape via the river. :)

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    Huh, that never occurred to me (which is funny, since I first discovered RLM/Plinkett while searching for Star Wars fan-edits), but I agree, you probably could improve the movies dramatically simply by subtracting elements. Guess it’s hard to complain about what we’re given when you consider that!

    Edit: Oh right, they mentioned the idea in the review. Shows how much I remember.

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